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Restons

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Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sat Jan 06, 2018 5:16 pm

Hi I'm wondering if any one could advice as I'm not very good and really not too sure as what to do.
I'm trying to help my wife as to an alleged debt from Tesco, we did the 3 letters process maybe 4 years ago and things hadn't really moved on various letters from debt collectors,who went quite on her. Now we had Cabot writing which was ignored they have now got Restons involved with a letter of claim persuant to the pre action protocol.
We then sent them a pre action conduct request for information letter I found on here that was composed by Lopsum
Restons have now replied saying that they don't seem it appropriate to provide me with the documentation I've asked for.
Any help whatsoever is gratefully received as I really don't have much idea as what to do


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Re: Restons

Post by Tiggy on Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:11 pm

@Johnnyred wrote:Hi I'm wondering if any one could advice as I'm not very good and really not too sure as what to do.
I'm trying to help my wife as to an alleged debt  from Tesco, we did the 3 letters process maybe 4 years ago and things hadn't really moved on various letters from debt collectors,who went quite on her. Now we had Cabot writing which was ignored they have now got Restons involved  with a letter of claim persuant to the pre action protocol.
We then sent them a pre action conduct request for information letter  I found on here that was composed by Lopsum
Restons have now replied saying that they don't seem it appropriate to provide me with the documentation I've asked for.
Any help whatsoever is gratefully received as I really don't have much idea as what to do

Couple of things, are you writing on your wife's behalf (ie in your wife's name and she signs the letters) or are you signing the letters ?

Secondly, when did Tesco's issue the formal default notice? This could be crucial as this sounds to be an older debt and may be getting towards being statute barred ( 6 years from issue of default if England and Wales or 5 years if in Scotland).

Did Restons send you a PAC questionnaire?

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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sat Jan 06, 2018 8:25 pm

Hi Tiggy thank you for the reply
Yes I'm writing on my wife's behalf I,m not sure when the default was issued I need to do some digging, there hasn't been a payment made for nearly 4 years
Sorry I,m not sure what the PAC questionnaire is I,m pretty much fumbling my way along

Edit

Have now found a default notice dated 16th December 2013

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Re: Restons

Post by warwick65 on Sat Jan 06, 2018 9:03 pm

If you sign up to Noddle it will hopefully have a record of the account and the default date - if its not on there you could SAR Tesco to find out for certain

Have you sent a S78 request to whomever owns the debt, is it Arrow Global?

What docs did you ask for in the pre action letter - I generally suggest DN , agreement, notice and deed of assignment

Edit: So sadly it is not SB so you need to be looking at other things such as non compliance with CCA , non compliance with DN , and assignment.

Do you know if the DN is compliant with S88

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Re: Restons

Post by Tiggy on Sun Jan 07, 2018 11:34 am

@Johnnyred wrote:Hi Tiggy  thank you for the reply
Yes I'm writing on my wife's behalf I,m not sure when the default was issued I need to do some digging, there hasn't been a payment made for nearly 4 years
Sorry I,m not sure what the PAC questionnaire is I,m pretty much fumbling my way along

Edit

Have now found a default notice dated 16th December 2013

If the default notice was issued 16th December 2013, then it's a year off being statute barred, so no help there then.

If the Pre Action Conduct letter was in your wife's name and she signed it then they had no grounds to reject the request. A PAC questionnaire is a Pre Action Conduct questionnaire and should be issued by claimants prior to the commencement of proceedings against individuals.

What was the original debt for, you said Tesco's but not whether it was a loan or credit card and what's the value (approximately) of the claim they've started?

What is the issue date on the claim form? You have 14 days to acknowledge service with the intention to defend - do that straight away, and 33 days from issue date to submit a defence.

Start by looking at the default notice, that has to be compliant with the provisions of Section 88 of the Consumer Credit Act.

You'll also have to issue a request for a copy of the agreement but I need to know what the original debt was for to say which section of the CCA you issue the request under.

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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:23 pm

Thank you for your replies time and energy it is greatly appreciated.
The debt was for a tesco credit card, the owners of the debt are now Cabot i believe.
We ignored all letters from Cabot.
Then Restons sent
Attachments
restons 1.1.jpg You don't have permission to download attachments.(247 Kb) Downloaded 3 times

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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sun Jan 07, 2018 12:27 pm

I then wrote to them with this copied from here






SENT BY RECORDED DELIVERY Your address

Your ref.:

Their address

Date

Dear Sirs,

Re: Your Client – xxxxx Limited
Pre Action Conduct - Request for Information

With regard to your letter dated xxxxx 2015, which stated Legal Action would be taken, I take this to be a Letter before Action under the above named Pre Action Conduct Protocol and as such I am responding accordingly.

As you have indicated you are acting on behalf of xxxxx Limited in this action, I assume you are authorised to accept service of documentation, therefore, please accept this request for Information sufficient to understand the claim being threatened and as such is in accordance Section 3 of the Pre Action Conduct, by way of Service Upon You and your client.

As I have never entered into any Legal Agreement or Contract with your client, for any monies or specifically for the alleged amount of £xxxxx; and I neither accept nor acknowledge the assertion any debt has been Legally and Absolutely Assigned to your client, I therefore, request the following documentation under Pre Action Conduct Section 6 (c) as proof of your Clients assertions of a Legal Obligation, to be provided to me within 40 days of the post marked date of this letter.

I. Pursuant to s.77-79 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (CCA1974) a copy of the Original Signed Consumer Credit Agreement, along with a copy of the original Terms & Conditions and any and all subsequent changes in said Terms & Conditions.

II. Statements of the Account referred to, including details of all payments made and calculation of how interest was charged against each item, leading to the Alleged Debt of £xxxxx.

III. Also, as this is an Alleged Debt, I believe Default Charges may have been applied to the Account and as such may be unlawful under the Unfair Consumer Contract Terms Regulations 1999, therefore, I would request details of each and every Default Charge applied to the Account (i.e. if the charge was for ‘Administration’ what Administration was undertaken to support the Default Charge) along with details of any Interest Charged against each Default Charge applied.

IV. In accordance with Section 87.1 Of the Consumer Credit Act 1974 (as amended) a copy of the Default Notice from the original owners of the Alleged Debt and Certified Copies of how this was served upon me.

V. A copy of the Legal / Absolute Assignment of the Agreement, including a copy of a Duly Executed Deed of Assignment and / or Deed of Tripartite Novation; and

VI. In accordance with Section 196 of the Law of Property Act 1925, Certified Copies of how I was served with the Alleged Legal Assignment.

VII. A copy of the Alleged Notice of Assignment sent by the original creditor to the Defendant and again, in accordance with Section 196 of the Law of Property Act 1925, Certified Copies of how this was Served upon me.

Should proceedings commence against me and your client fail to provide each and every document requested, I will make an Application to the Court to Stay your Clients claim until the request is complied with and request the Court impose Sanctions against yourself and your client for failure to adhere to the provisions of the above mentioned Practice Direction.

Also please be aware, each document listed is required to provide absolute and legal proof of your client’s contention of a legal indebtedness towards them and again, should your client fail to produce said documentation and Proceedings Commence against me I will apply to the Court to Stay your Clients claim Until said documentation is received.

As a part of my defense I will re-request production of each and every document under an appropriate Civil Procedure Rule, along with a request under CPR Part 39.a (3.3) for the original of every document upon which you intend to rely be brought to any subsequent hearing for examination.

Please note, where I have mentioned a document and there is in your clients possession more than one version of that same document owing to a modification, obliteration or other marking or feature, each version will be a separate document and you must provide a copy of each version of it to me. Your obligations extend to making a reasonable and proportionate search for any version(s) to include an obligation to recover and preserve such version(s) which are now in the possession of a third party.

I look forward to your response in due course.

Yours faithfully

They then responded with
Attachments
restons2.1.jpg You don't have permission to download attachments.(351 Kb) Downloaded 7 times

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Re: Restons

Post by warwick65 on Sun Jan 07, 2018 1:48 pm

Hi
You need to remember that Restons are always very difficult to deal with although that doesn't mean they can not be sorted out.

Did you send a S78 request to Cabot?
If not then get one sent asap

By the way, cabot Uk are unlicensed and I know a solicitor who has had several cases discontinued because - well maybe because they don't want the issue being challenged in court

Only this weekend, Restons discontinued a claim that they started, left stayed and then applied for a summary judgement - a common tactic

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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:20 pm

Hi Warwick
we haven't made any contact what so ever with Cabot.

will this template i have found be any good?

Dear Sirs,

Account No:

I hereby formally request a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement, pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to any account you deem to be mine, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days). You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request; the provisions of s.77 will apply.

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

Your attention is drawn to ss.5(2), 3(b),6 and 7 of the Consumer Protection from Unfair Trading Regulations 2008 (CPUTR). I enclose a personal cheque in the sum of £1.00, which is the statutory fee. Note that these funds are not to be used for any other purpose.

If you are unable to comply fully and properly with this request, you should confirm this in writing at the earliest opportunity, and certainly within the statutory time limit for compliance, and return the fee and then remove the incorrect entry from your systems.

I do, expect the main actions to be dealt with, as matter of course, and look forward to hearing from you within the prescribed timescales quoted.


Yours faithfully



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Re: Restons

Post by warwick65 on Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:30 pm

Hi yes you can send that or a much shorter version - say first three paragraphs

Just to note- for a loan you are sending a S77(1) request and where it mentions S77 at the bottom of the second paragraph it would be S77(4)

For a credit card it would be S78(1) and at the snd of the second paragraph S78(6).

So that gets sent to Cabot by royal mail signed for with a cheque or postal order for £1 . I would add a line in saying
'Please find enclosed a cheque /postal order No xxxx for the statutory fee of £1'


Make sure you keep copies of that and the receipt from the post office, I also always print out the proof of delivery from the track n trace site and add it to my file


I would then write a short missive to Restons saying
Thank you for your letter dated xxxxxx
Please find enclosed a copy of my request under the consumer credit act that was sent to your client onxxxxxx

As for the rest of their letters , to be honest I wouldn't worry too much- if they issue a claim I imagine you will be denying ever having received a DN or a NOA and you will be wanting them to prove the rights to bring the claim be providing the Deed of assignment. The fact you have a letter from them refusing it is all good and can be used to show they are unreasonable


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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Sun Jan 07, 2018 2:44 pm

thank you for your help
as i say i really dont have much idea at all is this edited version correct?

Dear Sirs,

Account No:

I hereby formally request a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement, pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to any account you deem to be mine, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days). You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request; the provisions of s.78(6) will apply.

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

yours faithfully

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Re: Restons

Post by warwick65 on Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:07 pm

@Johnnyred wrote:thank you for your help
as i say i really dont have much idea at all is this edited version correct?

Dear Sirs,

Account No:

I hereby formally request a copy of my Consumer Credit Agreement, pursuant to s.77/78 of the Consumer Credit Act 1974.

I enclose a cheque/postal order No xxxxxx for the statutory fee of £1

I require you to provide me with a true copy of the credit agreement relating to any account you deem to be mine, together with any other documentation the Act requires you to provide. I expect you to comply fully and properly with this request, within the statutory time limit (12 + 2 days). You are reminded that should you fail to comply with my request; the provisions of s.78(6) will apply.

If it is your view that you are not the creditor, s.175 of the CCA 1974 applies in the case of a simple assignment, and places a duty upon you to pass this request to the creditor. In the case of an absolute assignment, you are a creditor as defined by s.189. If you contend that you purchased the rights but not the duties of any agreement, you are reminded that s.189 of the Act is clear that an assignment is of both rights and duties.

yours faithfully

I have just added the line in about the fee

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Re: Restons

Post by warwick65 on Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:10 pm

I notice you say you have found the Default Notice- this could be crucial in defending the claim if it is not correct

Something to remember, in the small claims track you do not need to disclose what evidence you have, it really is up to them to prove a compliant one was sent- this is usually done via producing an accurate recon

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Re: Restons

Post by Johnnyred on Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:58 pm

Thank you for your help once again
S78 request sent to Cabot plus letter sent to Restons

this ia a copy of Default Notice

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Re: Restons

Post by Tiggy on Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:47 pm

@Johnnyred wrote:Thank you for your help once again
S78 request sent to Cabot plus letter sent to Restons

this ia a copy of Default Notice

I've deleted the attachment as you'd left sufficient details (date and values) to be able to easily identify your wife.  Please remove those details and repost.

I've also removed the letters from Restons for the same reason.

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