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by daveiron Fri Jan 19, 2024 10:02 pm
Moon phases
PCN on red route
+2
daveiron
jo
6 posters
Page 1 of 1
PCN on red route
Hi
I am a total techno phobe when it comes to using sites like this I have dyslexia so if im posting in wrong place please tell me!
this is my second post tonight im not sure the first one was in the right place........
So i park my car in a parking bay on red route allows 1 hour parking then no return.
I always photograph my car.
3weeks later I get a PCN stating the parking bay was suspended. In all the pics of mine you can see my car parked under the sign there is clearlly no suspension in place.
I appeal.
I send in my pics
TFL send me a pic of the road with a suspended parking sign about 100 feet away from where my car was 37 minutes after I had left.
Does anyone know any law on the place ment of suspended parking bays? I didnt see this suspension notice - i must have driven straight past it - and loads of other people must be going thru the same thing.
any thoughts/help really apprecaited. this is now going to the TFL court and I would like to produce some more evidence or legal terminolgy before that date if I can to stop it going ahead.
thanks!
I am a total techno phobe when it comes to using sites like this I have dyslexia so if im posting in wrong place please tell me!
this is my second post tonight im not sure the first one was in the right place........
So i park my car in a parking bay on red route allows 1 hour parking then no return.
I always photograph my car.
3weeks later I get a PCN stating the parking bay was suspended. In all the pics of mine you can see my car parked under the sign there is clearlly no suspension in place.
I appeal.
I send in my pics
TFL send me a pic of the road with a suspended parking sign about 100 feet away from where my car was 37 minutes after I had left.
Does anyone know any law on the place ment of suspended parking bays? I didnt see this suspension notice - i must have driven straight past it - and loads of other people must be going thru the same thing.
any thoughts/help really apprecaited. this is now going to the TFL court and I would like to produce some more evidence or legal terminolgy before that date if I can to stop it going ahead.
thanks!
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
Hi,jo
Do your pics show any date / time .If they do that should be all you need. If not inform them you require evidence of your vehicle parked in a suspended area.
Do your pics show any date / time .If they do that should be all you need. If not inform them you require evidence of your vehicle parked in a suspended area.
daveiron- Admin
- Posts : 4892
Join date : 2017-01-17
Re: PCN on red route
Hi jo,
How to beat UK speeding tickets (2014)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNxvlr_OKyg
this will be VERY helpful by you getting your opponents to PROVE what they claim.
"How is your evidence proof of claim? - is it proof of a crime or is it evidence if a conveyance on the land etc?"
Watch that vid & get some other GOOD pointers too.
You could also read:
http://boevat.org.uk
about PCN(s) - alot of again very good info.
Hope this all helps
LS
How to beat UK speeding tickets (2014)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNxvlr_OKyg
this will be VERY helpful by you getting your opponents to PROVE what they claim.
"How is your evidence proof of claim? - is it proof of a crime or is it evidence if a conveyance on the land etc?"
Watch that vid & get some other GOOD pointers too.
You could also read:
http://boevat.org.uk
about PCN(s) - alot of again very good info.
Hope this all helps
LS
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Hi Daveiron
thank you yes I have told them the times the photos were taken and one of them is exactly the same time as one of theres, but they are still dismissing my photos which is quite shocking - i guess they made a lot of money that day.
LS,
thank you for the site it is very interesting and formative, I am still trying to work it all out tho. From what I read it seems I have to invoice TFL - not 100% sure about this as it takes me a bit longer to process stuff but will get there in the end. It took me a while to get around the 3 letter rule and removal of implied right of access too!
thank you both for your help.
Jo
thank you yes I have told them the times the photos were taken and one of them is exactly the same time as one of theres, but they are still dismissing my photos which is quite shocking - i guess they made a lot of money that day.
LS,
thank you for the site it is very interesting and formative, I am still trying to work it all out tho. From what I read it seems I have to invoice TFL - not 100% sure about this as it takes me a bit longer to process stuff but will get there in the end. It took me a while to get around the 3 letter rule and removal of implied right of access too!
thank you both for your help.
Jo
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
Hi jo,
You say you have a photo of your car parked under the sign,
You require their evidence that shows where they claim the bay was suspended.
Remember the burden of proof always lies with them .The sign above your car must be more relevant than one a hundred yards away.
You say you have a photo of your car parked under the sign,
You require their evidence that shows where they claim the bay was suspended.
Remember the burden of proof always lies with them .The sign above your car must be more relevant than one a hundred yards away.
daveiron- Admin
- Posts : 4892
Join date : 2017-01-17
Re: PCN on red route
Yes there are example invoices on that site, download & modify to suit your situation.jo wrote:From what I read it seems I have to invoice TFL -
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
hi im not sure what to do now.
do i write back to TFL and tell them their picture does not show the suspension sign above my car at the same time that I parked and is taken later or do I do the invoice?
Im not sure which way to go as it looks like i have already entered into contract with them by appealing? I have less than a week to get stuff back to them.
I did wonder if they are bound by their own rules - like a suspension sign must be visible by the driver at such and such a distance something like that?
thanks for all your help.
in future I will definately do the invoice - the 3 letter rule has helped me get rid of a lot of debt collectors.
do i write back to TFL and tell them their picture does not show the suspension sign above my car at the same time that I parked and is taken later or do I do the invoice?
Im not sure which way to go as it looks like i have already entered into contract with them by appealing? I have less than a week to get stuff back to them.
I did wonder if they are bound by their own rules - like a suspension sign must be visible by the driver at such and such a distance something like that?
thanks for all your help.
in future I will definately do the invoice - the 3 letter rule has helped me get rid of a lot of debt collectors.
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
Hi jo,
I would demand to see the evidence. No evidence no case.
I would demand to see the evidence. No evidence no case.
daveiron- Admin
- Posts : 4892
Join date : 2017-01-17
Re: PCN on red route
Hi they sent me a big package of stuff that i dont understand!
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
Did they send photos showing your car in what is a clearly marked suspended bay ? that is the evidence
daveiron- Admin
- Posts : 4892
Join date : 2017-01-17
Re: PCN on red route
Jo,
I know its easy to get into a big melt down over these sort of things but...
Have NO fear - easy to say again I know as I have been through this sort of thing myself.
So where to go?
Not too sure of what exactly you have filled out but NEVER follow thier appeals process as that is sort of admitting - guilt but take into account...
Remember always deal with your case & never theirs'.
Even if you have started thier appeals process from here on in start with those 2 down loads from boevat.org.uk & modify to suit your situation.
As daveiron has already stated - get them to prove whatever they claim - thats all this is about.
Did you watch that yt vid I posted earlier? You will get some serious pointers of what you can say to them - ie prove what you claim.
If you can find the old getoutofdebtfree.org site & look for a posting "Read this" or "you must read this", that is even better with more info. If I can dig it out will post here for you - no garruntees though!
all the best
I know its easy to get into a big melt down over these sort of things but...
Have NO fear - easy to say again I know as I have been through this sort of thing myself.
So where to go?
Not too sure of what exactly you have filled out but NEVER follow thier appeals process as that is sort of admitting - guilt but take into account...
Remember always deal with your case & never theirs'.
Even if you have started thier appeals process from here on in start with those 2 down loads from boevat.org.uk & modify to suit your situation.
As daveiron has already stated - get them to prove whatever they claim - thats all this is about.
Did you watch that yt vid I posted earlier? You will get some serious pointers of what you can say to them - ie prove what you claim.
If you can find the old getoutofdebtfree.org site & look for a posting "Read this" or "you must read this", that is even better with more info. If I can dig it out will post here for you - no garruntees though!
all the best
- Attachments
Last edited by LionsShare on Fri Jul 13, 2018 8:13 pm; edited 2 times in total (Reason for editing : added attachment)
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Jo,
there is more as well, if you want more info please ask.
If you want the jack beetson speech google taht yourself as the link in the zip does NOT work!
LS
there is more as well, if you want more info please ask.
If you want the jack beetson speech google taht yourself as the link in the zip does NOT work!
LS
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Hi Jo,
After digging around my backups found this hope it helps:
the file "the way it is" was down loaded from the origonal website, you can not get it anymore. Hope it all helps - GOOD LUCK!
LS
After digging around my backups found this hope it helps:
the file "the way it is" was down loaded from the origonal website, you can not get it anymore. Hope it all helps - GOOD LUCK!
LS
- Attachments
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Hi Jo,
In the archbold attachment that is about getting fair access to the "Courts" & getting the palintiff to prove.....
FFWD to 15:00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR_a2TqThIw
cannot say it any simpler! based on experience!
In the archbold attachment that is about getting fair access to the "Courts" & getting the palintiff to prove.....
FFWD to 15:00
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bR_a2TqThIw
cannot say it any simpler! based on experience!
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Hi Jo,
If you decide to "prosecute" those who "claim" against you then:
FFWD 1:00:50 & listen & when i say listen - listen REAL good!
The plaintiff MUST PROVE...
There is NO direct reference to say this but listen to what is said & make your own mind - to me - YOU plaintiff PROVE...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHnXZzI-2-A
Cannot say it ANY simpler.
All the best LS
If you decide to "prosecute" those who "claim" against you then:
FFWD 1:00:50 & listen & when i say listen - listen REAL good!
The plaintiff MUST PROVE...
There is NO direct reference to say this but listen to what is said & make your own mind - to me - YOU plaintiff PROVE...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XHnXZzI-2-A
Cannot say it ANY simpler.
All the best LS
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
Re: PCN on red route
Hi thanks for all this. just getting up to speed with it all and watching the video atm I am starting to understand the processes a bit. My problem is my brain is slow LOL
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
on their original letter does it say if you have done anything " illegal " if the answer is no then don`t worry because if you had done anything illegal they would have told you straight away . send the BoeVat letter 1 just to let them know you know what they are up to ,they will pretend to ignore your letter and send you another letter full of shit to try frighten you .Send them letter 2 ,after this they will probs still send you another intimidating letter full of lies ,it`s up to you if you send letter 2 again at this point, but by now they will know you are on to them so you could perhaps just ignore them from now on ,remember to send your letters to be "signed for" when you send them from the post office,it`s proof you sent them and is less than £2 ,and when they do fuck off eventually give yourself a pat on the back and thank the BoeVat bros and all the helpful people on here.
eargoggles- news worthy
- Posts : 115
Join date : 2017-07-31
Re: PCN on red route
hi thanks everyone!
sorry for my slow reply
I sent them the first BOVEAT letter. am now waiting to see. how long before I send the 2nd one?
sorry for my slow reply
I sent them the first BOVEAT letter. am now waiting to see. how long before I send the 2nd one?
jo- Newb
- Posts : 8
Join date : 2018-06-24
Re: PCN on red route
Hi jo,
I would follow the Boavat advice ,if it tells you if or when to send letter 2. If it does not then follow eargoggles & lionshares advice they seem to well versed on the procedure.
I would follow the Boavat advice ,if it tells you if or when to send letter 2. If it does not then follow eargoggles & lionshares advice they seem to well versed on the procedure.
daveiron- Admin
- Posts : 4892
Join date : 2017-01-17
Re: PCN on red route
What daveiron says is true or as I do in utilities is give an actual cut off date in letter 1. If you have something back depending on content you may/not send letter 2.
Why not give it say 2 calendar weeks (or 1 week if you like) & send letter 2
hope it all goes well
LS
Why not give it say 2 calendar weeks (or 1 week if you like) & send letter 2
hope it all goes well
LS
LionsShare- Moderator
- Posts : 3227
Join date : 2017-04-26
Location : Literally Where Ever I Am
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