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Post by itheman on Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:34 pm

hello all, wondering if you could advise me on the best way to tackle this matter

just steamed it open, 1st Credit Finance (an HSBC business loan) Issue Date 28th Feb - I have 5 days to reply.

its from County Court Business Centre (Bournemouth - miles away from me)

1st credit were assigned the debt 15/12/16, was originally £7514.66 now £8156.99

was owned by Hillesden Securities and at an old address of mine, i only only got on electoral roll to vote in brexit. default date 30/04/12 - it's close to the 6 year mark but i don't know if any two communications in this time....help!

anymore information i should give?

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Post by itheman on Thu Mar 15, 2018 1:06 am

Hello again WokeBro,
i read on goodf site about returning to sender any letters addressed to your strawman.
It also said that if you were curious about who/what it related to then stream it open.
There was also some comment along the lines that once a summons/claim has been issued. If it is RTS several times the court will not/is reluctant to re issue a claim. I'm sure to have some detail wrong but I'll try and find then post up here but no doubt someone on here wrote it Smile

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Post by Ausk on Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:39 am

suggest that returning such and similar envelopes UNCLAIMED might be more effective.

Did it not say something on the envelop about returning it if was not/unclaimed?

By opening it, keeping it or responding to it, it may be, in law, that one has CLAIMED or accepted the envelope and therefore the document and its contents.

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Post by pieintheskywhenIdie on Thu Mar 15, 2018 8:01 am

Is this an actual court claim form, I mean sent by the court? If so then doing anything other than responding and defending will mean a default judgement against you.

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Post by itheman on Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:17 am

No Ausk, just if undelivered please return to...

pieintheskywhenidle, there is a claim number and THE COUNT COURT blurred (low-res) stamp typething on it.

i can't find the info i saw on goodf just now.

it is not addressed to me as the living person it is to some ALL CAPS PERSON, that is the basis i think that it can/should be RTS?
i have missed the 3 letters to send to 1st credit, so guess i have no chance to put in a defence?

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Post by Tiggy on Thu Mar 15, 2018 7:25 pm

The Court simply don't care if you return it unopened or not as it's deemed served 5 days after it's posted.

Basically, if you return it unopened, in 14 days time you'll have another CCJ as they'll get a Judgement by Default.

claimants love it when someone does this, they get an easy order against you and you'll have absolutely no chance of getting that order set aside.


Last edited by Tiggy on Fri Mar 16, 2018 2:11 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post by Ausk on Fri Mar 16, 2018 8:53 am

"The Court simply don't care if you return it unopened or not as it's deemed served 5 days after it's posted."

Happy with that Tiggy but thats just a measure of how much the law has been debased and abused in law to enable legal tyranny to reign.

It happens here also but for any law that does not pass the fair and just test of 'yes I am happy to submit to that law.' then its an act of tyranny.

All laws are supposed to contain a remedy. Its one the basic of the rule of law.

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Post by Tiggy on Fri Mar 16, 2018 11:25 am

@Ausk wrote:"The Court simply don't care if you return it unopened or not as it's deemed served 5 days after it's posted."

Happy with that Tiggy but thats just a measure of how much the law has been debased and abused in law to enable legal tyranny to reign.

It happens here also but for any law that does not pass the fair and just test of 'yes I am happy to submit to that law.' then its an act of tyranny.

All laws are supposed to contain a remedy. Its one the basic of the rule of law.
The best thing to do is deal with the claim, not stick your head in the sand or send it back unopened, that's just asking for trouble.

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Post by itheman on Fri Mar 16, 2018 3:14 pm

Have it in front of me now, it is actually £8666.99

This is new to me, i want to defend but all i have in my defence is it's addressed to a Mr xxxx and all seems so vague as i don't quite get it, one thing to grasp the notions but to use them...that's real. maybe if i'd tried the 3 letters earlier i might have been in a better position.

Any suggestions to help in a direction that i should be focusing on?

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Post by Tiggy on Fri Mar 16, 2018 5:32 pm

@itheman wrote:Have it in front of me now, it is actually £8666.99

This is new to me, i want to defend but all i have in my defence is it's addressed to a Mr xxxx and all seems so vague as i don't quite get it, one thing to grasp the notions but to use them...that's real. maybe if i'd tried the 3 letters earlier i might have been in a better position.

Any suggestions to help in a direction that i should be focusing on?
The first thing to do is to go onto the MCOL site and Acknowledge Service of the Claim with the Intention to Defend, once you've done that you have 33 days from the issue date on the claim form to submit your defence, so get that date fixed in your head - you MUST have submitted a defence by then.

Next you need to send either to the Claimant or their Solicitors if their using one:

A Request for Further information using CPR (Civil Procedure Rule) 18, and
A Request for a Copy of the Agreement.

What's the original debt for, credit card / loan?
When did you actually default (stop paying) and when did they issue the default notice?

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Post by itheman on Fri Mar 16, 2018 6:56 pm

Hi Tiggy and thanks,

Claimant is 1st Credit and address to send is Lester Aldridge LLP - Solicitors, any particular structure for the requests or just a letter to them?

Debt was for a business card/overdraft with HSBC

This is from my Equifax: Default Date - 30/04/2012

They are saying:
The Defendant was advanced money on a Business loan/overdraft under an account held with the original creditor, which was repayable in full on demand. The original creditor demanded payment of the monies outstanding on his business loan/overdraft but repayment has not been made in full.
On 15/12/2016 debt was assigned to 1st Credit...sum of £xyz
A Statutory Notice of Assignment was to the Defendant
CLAIMANT CLAIMS...from 01/02/17....then interest 8% from 01/02/17.....

No other details on this claim form

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Post by Tiggy on Sat Mar 17, 2018 9:45 am

So they've not separated the two out - the card and the flexiloan have both been lumped together?

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Post by itheman on Sat Mar 17, 2018 11:14 am

i guess not, both card and overdraft were for the business overdraft pool. Can this help?

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Post by itheman on Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:11 pm

I have not used my email before for any courts or claims. Is it recommend that i create a new one with recipient as "me" of the family "us"?
i guess that i need to establish me the sovereign opposed to me the strawman?
Not really sure how this transition happens or when it should start?
Many thanks

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Post by itheman on Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:39 pm

Hi all, should i also contest jurisdiction?

sorry but this is all very new to me

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Post by Tiggy on Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:34 pm

@itheman wrote:Hi all, should i also contest jurisdiction?

sorry but this is all very new to me
No, that would be pointless, the County Courts have jurisdiction to hear debt claims.

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Post by itheman on Mon Mar 19, 2018 8:51 pm

Thanks Tiggy, i had responded to the AOS before your post.

Does filling AOS mean i have consented to their authority?
- My response has been to defend all of the claim
- To contest jurisdiction (this i believe, if i do not submit reason why they will ignore in any case). The reason i decided to do this was to keep all options open...i get that persons/ALL CAPS are commercial entities to be used as a means of being robbed of their FIAT by the other corporations/governments and banks; and that a living man/woman is free living by common law. But i don't really know what i'm doing, is this to see if they have all evidence to support their claim? am i now in a County Court - even though i never consented to it (knowingly anyway)? Could i have several options open depending on what they reply with?

Now i have to send the solicitor:
A Request for Further information using CPR (Civil Procedure Rule) 18, and
A Request for a Copy of the Agreement.
Is there a template available? The three letter approach looks to me like it is for earlier stages that where i am

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Post by itheman on Wed Mar 21, 2018 9:22 pm

Does anyone know if this CPR18 request the most relevant/current?

http://www.getoutofdebtfree.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=107329

Check out this Tiggy post (viewtopic.php?f=5&t=86170&start=10#.VZ_B-YZ4WK1) who I'm sure will be along to tell you if it has been superceded;

Re: Lowell &Bryan Carter County court claim Heelllllp!

Postby Tiggy » Mon May 25, 2015 9:10 am
In respect to the CPR 31, technically, when you issued the CPR 31 request your claim hadn't (and still hasn't been all allocated to the small claims track), but what we're seeing is the courts rejecting 31 requests because they will be allocated to the small claims. So to be certain send them this (amended), because this does apply to ALL claims

Dear Sirs,

Re: (Claimant's name) v (Your name) Case No:

CPR18 Preliminary Request for further information / clarification

On the Xxxxx 2015, I received the Claim Form in this case issued by you out of the Northampton County Court.

I confirm having returned my acknowledgement of service to the court in which I indicate my intention to contest your entire claim.

Prior to the issue of proceedings I had delivered a request for the production of the Agreement referred to in the Particulars of Claim, and on which you intend to rely. That request was ignored.

Please treat this letter as my Preliminary Request for further information made, under CPR Part 18 for the following, including any documentation mentioned within the particulars of Claim, for which I request the production of a verified and legible copy) please accept this request by way of Service upon You:

1.The agreement, including the specific Terms at the point the alleged Agreement was made and any subsequent changes. You will appreciate by reason of the provisions of CPR 39.a (3.3) requires The originals of the documents contained in the trial bundle, together with copies of any other court orders should be available at the trial. Further, that any general conditions incorporated in the contract should also be attached.

2. The deed of assignment.
3. All notices of assignment.
4. The default warning letter.
5. The default notice.
5.1 Termination Notice.

6. I deny any indebtedness to the Claimant but particularly deny they are due statutory interest on the alleged amount of £xxx.xx and as such I request full disclosure of the amount the Claimant alleges to have paid for this alleged debt.

7. Also, I would request under Civil Procedure Rule 39 PD 39a (3.3) the originals of any documents upon which you, the claimant intends to rely, are brought to any subsequent hearing for examination

You should ensure compliance with your CPR 18 duties and ensure that the information I have requested is collated and received by me within 14 days of receiving this letter. Failure to produce the information requested will result in an Application to the Court to order the information be provided.

If you are unable to comply with this request and believe that you will never be able to comply with this request you must tell me in writing.

Please note that if you should fail to comply with this request, I will make an application to the court for an order that the proceedings be struck out or stayed for non-compliance and a summary costs order.

Yours faithfully

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Post by itheman on Sun Mar 25, 2018 5:47 pm

Just discovered that 1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LTD has changed it's name to INTRUM UK FINANCE LIMITED. 1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LTD is on the claim form (issue date 28/02/18).

Previous company names
Name Period
1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LIMITED 09 Mar 2001 - 01 Mar 2018

Does anyone know if this affects anything?

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Post by Tiggy on Sun Mar 25, 2018 6:18 pm

@itheman wrote:Just discovered that 1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LTD has changed it's name to INTRUM UK FINANCE LIMITED. 1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LTD is on the claim form (issue date 28/02/18).

Previous company names
Name Period
1ST CREDIT (FINANCE) LIMITED 09 Mar 2001 - 01 Mar 2018

Does anyone know if this affects anything?
No, the name change was made after the issue of the claim.

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Post by itheman on Mon Mar 26, 2018 10:36 am

Are there a valid reasons that can be used to extend the time for submitting a defence?

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Post by actinglikeabanker's Ghost on Mon Mar 26, 2018 11:29 am

Hey, see civil rule procedure 15.5 in the following link := https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part15

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Post by itheman on Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:01 pm

Cheers alab,

Interesting points on that rule here
http://www.civillitigationbrief.com/2014/05/15/you-can-agree-to-extend-time-soon-but-be-very-careful-five-danger-points-explored/

How f#*!ed up is this system when solicitors have this on their website "suicide prevention" FFS...it's appalling

If you require emotional support or you are unable to cope for some other reason you may wish to contact:

Samaritans – samaritans.org – 116 123
Grassroots Suicide Prevention – www.prevent-suicide.org.uk

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Post by Tiggy on Mon Mar 26, 2018 12:18 pm

Why do you want to delay submitting your defence? Any delay works in the favour of claimant and unless your exempt you have to pay for an N244 application to delay.

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