Direct attachment of earnings please HELP

CRUDEN v. NEALE, 2 N.C. 338 (1796) 2 S.E. 70 June 14, 2016 "There, every man is independent of all laws, except those prescribed by nature. He is not bound by any institutions formed by his fellowman without his consent."

I wanted to pop this in regards the void order, below is part of the text from Gumshoe Sleuths video … I think at this point this would be the best way to go, especially if as you seem to be saying the lawful process is and has been all over the place.

You can listen to the full video on the YouTube channel; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4c9_UB0yEM I have the video script in document format if you wish I can send it to you, however instead of ploughing through all your steps up to now and trying to unravel how you got to this point it appears to me to be best to go straight for the void order.

There is some research which I am trying to find for you that will stop your employer garnishing your wages, I will try and find this today or tomorrow, however from memory it is by going to the top CEO and holding him/her liable for taking the funds without your consent to do so, (see top Cruden v Neale) and it is irrelevant as to whether the matter is in dispute or not in the courts, they still need your consent. Now obviously most people do not wish to go this route as it causes or can cause problems between employer and employee as the employer will be doing things by the book, especially if it is a corporation, nevertheless you can still hold the CEO liable. But again as we all know at the moment they are ignoring and carrying on regardless, it is your persistence I think that wins the day; because the bottom line here is; it is they that are causing loss, harm and injury not you and that is the ONLY LAW of this land.

Part text from the video

“We need to know right at the start if something has actually happened to you, if a court has got a judgment on you, it's not the end of the world, there's such thing as ‘void order,’ and a void order is pretty simple, and also this ‘setting aside,’ something else to learn, but a void order is dead simple, and you could require a void order, on anything that's been done in the past on you, and the way I would do it back to the Data Subject Access Request, ‘ker ching ching,’ and that process in all honesty because it just fits every process every aspect, you put a notice together requiring them to either, ‘void the order’ or answer the following questions, I would start it off with “it’s my full belief, my firm belief, that this case dated blah, blah, blah, which a judgment was served on such and such a date at such and such a court, blah, blah, blah, was brought into court without due process of law, due process was not followed throughout the entire case and judgment, and on these grounds I would require either, on the Data Subject Access Request, blah, blah, blah,” all your questions answered, or an immediate void order and a written confirmation that the order has been voided within 14, 28 [days] whatever you want to give them.”
“…so after the fact, if they've gone ahead with something, you reply to that with the ‘void order’ with the data subject access request, and follow the process on the data subject access request, you can put in the bottom, “if no response is received within the 14 or 28 days or the time allocated, it shall be assumed, that this is your confession of guilt, etc. etc., that know, that it is fully accepted at law, and with all parties concerned, that due process of law was not followed in this instance,”…


I hope this helps.

I have followed up with two emails requesting the information and no response, i haven't called them yet although i have some free time next week so i will go to the local court in person and request it. I will go through your response later and inwardly digest, thank you as i am trying to learn so that i can challenge more myself. I had originally called the NCC and requested the documents and they said Huddersfield CC had them, they in turn said it was NCC and i was pretty much bounced around.

Sam97 wrote:CRUDEN v. NEALE, 2 N.C. 338 (1796) 2 S.E. 70 June 14, 2016 "There, every man is independent of all laws, except those prescribed by nature. He is not bound by any institutions formed by his fellowman without his consent."

I wanted to pop this in regards the void order, below is part of the text from Gumshoe Sleuths video … I think at this point this would be the best way to go, especially if as  you seem to be saying the lawful process is and has been all over the place.

You can listen to the full video on the YouTube channel; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K4c9_UB0yEM I have the video script in document format if you wish I can send it to you, however instead of ploughing through all your steps up to now and trying to unravel how you got to this point it appears to me to be best to go straight for the void order.  

There is some research which I am trying to find for you that will stop your employer garnishing your wages, I will try and find this today or tomorrow, however from memory it is by going to the top CEO and holding him/her liable for taking the funds without your consent to do so, (see top Cruden v Neale) and it is irrelevant as to whether the matter is in dispute or not in the courts, they still need your consent.  Now obviously most people do not wish to go this route as it causes or can cause problems between employer and employee as the employer will be doing things by the book, especially if it is a corporation, nevertheless you can still hold the CEO liable.  But again as we all know at the moment they are ignoring and carrying on regardless, it is your persistence I think that wins the day; because the bottom line here is; it is they that are causing loss, harm and injury not you and that is the ONLY LAW of this land.

Part text from the video

“We need to know right at the start if something has actually happened to you, if a court has got a judgment on you, it's not the end of the world, there's such thing as ‘void order,’ and a void order is pretty simple, and also this ‘setting aside,’ something else to learn, but a void order is dead simple, and you could require a void order, on anything that's been done in the past on you, and the way I would do it back to the Data Subject Access Request, ‘ker ching ching,’ and that process in all honesty because it just fits every process every aspect, you put a notice together requiring them to either, ‘void the order’ or answer the following questions, I would start it off with “it’s my full belief, my firm belief, that this case dated blah, blah, blah, which a judgment was served on such and such a date at such and such a court, blah, blah, blah, was brought into court without due process of law, due process was not followed throughout the entire case and judgment, and on these grounds I would require either, on the Data Subject Access Request, blah, blah, blah,” all your questions answered, or an immediate void order and a written confirmation that the order has been voided within 14, 28 [days] whatever you want to give them.”
“…so after the fact, if they've gone ahead with something, you reply to that with the ‘void order’ with the data subject access request, and follow the process on the data subject access request, you can put in the bottom, “if no response is received within the 14 or 28 days or the time allocated, it shall be assumed, that this is your confession of guilt, etc. etc., that know, that it is fully accepted at law, and with all parties concerned, that due process of law was not followed in this instance,”…


I hope this helps.

Thank you for this, i will go through this later tonight, i have no idea if this carries any weight at all, but i also have another post where i was banned from driving for six months, the reason for this was "failure to identify the driver" as you will see from the post it was complex and all stemming from our address being complicated and i do not receive all of my mail because of this. I submitted a request to reopen the case (section 142) and was successful as the court withdrew and said no further action to be taken as they agreed with my reasoning. The very same applies here, i could not defend this case as i did not receive any documentation at all, had i been able to defend this then i am 100% certain that a judge would rule in my favour, and all i am asking is for a judge to let me defend what the plaintiff is saying. You are correct that lawful process with this has been all over the place and i have followed THEIR instructions to the letter.

Try looking at Statutory Declarations ,and file it at the court.
Stick to facts & dont make assumptions. I dont think the court will
be able to ignore this.

https://www.lawble.co.uk/statutory-declaration/

daveiron wrote:Try looking at Statutory Declarations ,and file it at the court.

It's all a bit confusing as two essentially unrelated matters are being discussed. However I think the OP is trying to sort out this civil case, and the criminal case just mentioned in passing.

daveiron wrote:Try looking at Statutory Declarations ,and file it at the court.
Stick to facts & dont make assumptions. I dont think the court will
be able to ignore this.

https://www.lawble.co.uk/statutory-declaration/

Wow this was massively helpful, i never really knew this at all, thank you for sharing.

flyingfish wrote:

daveiron wrote:Try looking at Statutory Declarations ,and file it at the court.

It's all a bit confusing as two essentially unrelated matters are being discussed. However I think the OP is trying to sort out this civil case, and the criminal case just mentioned in passing.

Correct.

M.walker wrote:

flyingfish wrote:It's all a bit confusing as two essentially unrelated matters are being discussed. However I think the OP is trying to sort out this civil case, and the criminal case just mentioned in passing.

Correct.

Cheers, in that case I'm not sure how a SD is used in civil proceedings.

From what i recall from this thread , the main issue is the failure of the
court to comply with what has been requested.
My thinking was a SD be based upon the failure of the court along with
their failure of their duty of care.

From  what I understand there were issues with the OP receiving the court paperwork, partly due to some underlying issues receiving post at his address but also due to the court using an incorrect postcode. These resulted in a default judgement against the OP.

Again, from what I understand the OP applied for set aside in February, i dont think we had details but it appears this failed (we speculate because the court didnt hold that he had an arguable defence). He made a second application in June, also unsuccessful on the grounds that the application duplicated the earlier one.

If that's all correct, I think the correct process is going to be to appeal but I'm not sure whether you would appeal the original judgement, or the set aside order.

flyingfish wrote:From  what I understand there were issues with the OP receiving the court paperwork, partly due to some underlying issues receiving post at his address but also due to the court using an incorrect postcode. These resulted in a default judgement against the OP.

Again, from what I understand the OP applied for set aside in February, i dont think we had details but it appears this failed (we speculate because the court didnt hold that he had an arguable defence). He made a second application in June, also unsuccessful on the grounds that the application duplicated the earlier one.

If that's all correct, I think the correct process is going to be to appeal but I'm not sure whether you would appeal the original judgement, or the set aside order.

this is where things get very complicated, when we start to cross over things and include other cases and in particular when two cases that are discussed in the same thread are under 2 different jurisdictions !!

i may even be wrong myself here but...........

i) This case is a civil case so will have been in county court no statutory demands or anything like that, that is another case but same original poster (OP)

ii) the claimant issued a claim with CCBC but the OP knew nothing about it as they never received the claim forms.

iii) Judgment was awarded to the Claimant by default and again the OP had no idea this had happened as again received no notification from the courts

iv) Claimant applies to the court for an attachment of earnings, using their default judgment to get their money

v) Court again awards in favour of claimant but yet again OP is not made aware of this.

vi) OP finally finds out something has happened when their employer tells them they are obliged to take money from their earnings.

vii) OP then applies to have the order (s) set aside on the basis of NOT receiving the claim form and stating they do not owe the money claimed ( no idea how strong their argument was on this though as have never had that information )

viii) Paperwork for set aside application appears before a Judge who obviously thought there was enough in the argument to schedule a hearing for the set aside to be heard in Court giving the defendant a chance to be heard.

ix) YET again the OP ( defendant ) receives no paperwork for the hearing so does not know that it is taking place

x) the OP does not show up at the hearing so the Judge dismisses the set aside application on the grounds that the defendant didn't bother to show up ! so the attachment of earnings still stands

xi ) OP ( defendant ) makes a further application to set aside which appears before the same Judge ( again i dont know what the OP put in their argument for the second application as i have not had this information )

xii) Judge dismisses it first hand without another thought for reasons given above, i think when it gets to this stage a second application needs to be an appeal ( but this is really outside of my knowledge ) , so maybe due process was not followed but it is now getting complicated.

xiii ) so currently the orders in place still stand and money is being deducted from the OP's wages.

i posted about void orders which is a minefield and needs to be done properly and for the right reasons and is very very rare, it was all i had left to offer at the time. There are reasons that an order can be void but be very very careful how you approach it and use the correct reasons and any case law to support.

this is how i see this particular thread and may be totally wrong as to what has happened if so then

waylander62 wrote:

flyingfish wrote:From  what I understand there were issues with the OP receiving the court paperwork, partly due to some underlying issues receiving post at his address but also due to the court using an incorrect postcode. These resulted in a default judgement against the OP.

Again, from what I understand the OP applied for set aside in February, i dont think we had details but it appears this failed (we speculate because the court didnt hold that he had an arguable defence). He made a second application in June, also unsuccessful on the grounds that the application duplicated the earlier one.

If that's all correct, I think the correct process is going to be to appeal but I'm not sure whether you would appeal the original judgement, or the set aside order.

this is where things get very complicated,  when we start to cross over things and include other cases and in particular when two cases that are discussed in the same thread are under 2 different jurisdictions !!

i may even be wrong myself here but...........

i) This case is a civil case so will have been in county court no statutory demands or anything like that, that is another case but same original poster (OP)

ii) the claimant issued a claim with CCBC but the OP knew nothing about it as they never received the claim forms.

iii) Judgment was awarded to the Claimant by default and again the OP had no idea this had happened as again received no notification from the courts

iv) Claimant applies to the court for an attachment of earnings, using their default judgment to get their money

v) Court again awards in favour of claimant but yet again OP is not made aware of this.

vi) OP finally finds out something has happened when their employer tells them they are obliged to take money from their earnings.

vii) OP then applies to have the order (s) set aside on the basis of NOT receiving the claim form and stating they do not owe the money claimed ( no idea how strong their argument was on this though as have never had that information )

viii) Paperwork for set aside application appears before a Judge who obviously thought there was enough in the argument to schedule a hearing for the set aside to be heard in Court giving the defendant a chance to be heard.

ix) YET again the OP ( defendant ) receives no paperwork for the hearing so does not know that it is taking place

x) the OP does not show up at the hearing so the Judge dismisses the set aside application on the grounds that the defendant didn't bother to show up ! so the attachment of earnings still stands

xi ) OP ( defendant ) makes a further application to set aside which appears before the same Judge ( again i dont know what the OP put in their argument for the second application as i have not had this information )

xii) Judge dismisses it first hand without another thought for reasons given above, i think when it gets to this stage a second application needs to be an appeal ( but this is really outside of my knowledge ) , so maybe due process was not followed but it is now getting complicated.

xiii ) so currently the orders in place still stand and money is being deducted from the OP's wages.

i posted about void orders which is a minefield and needs to be done properly and for the right reasons and is very very rare, it was all i had left to offer at the time. There are reasons that an order can be void but be very very careful how you approach it and use the correct reasons and any case law to support.

this is how i see this particular thread and may be totally wrong as to what has happened if so then      

This is EXACTLY correct, so you have done extremely well in quite a complex post that has somehow overlapped, i have submitted a DSAR to the CC for all of the documents, they have said it will be completed in due course and this was on 28.06.23, since then i have heard nothing, i have raised a complaint to them and raised a complaint to the ICO with a further complaint raised to the court today. This has gotten beyond a joke now, i need to defend this but they are not supplying me with any documents so i have no idea what has been sent and to whom, surely......there must be something i can do here I've paid £750 to this person already and it should never ever have been allowed. The courts are literally ignoring me, they have done the same with the DSAR for my other post where my driving bad and fine was withdrawn because i proved to the courts there is an issue with my address ( the very SAME issue here, which is why i KNOW a judge would rule in my favour. I can not underestimate the stress this is causing me and i have PTSD which i have outlined.

Try complaining to the MoJ;
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/ministry-of-justice/about/complaints-procedure

or

https://www.complaints.judicialconduct.gov.uk/makeacomplaint/

Also pick out the relevant principles here,
they are in breach of 5 of the 7.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-7-principles-of-public-life/the-7-principles-of-public-life--2

Ok so after my latest complaint via email they have responded with this below, however on 28.06 they responded by saying "i confirm your request is being processed, you will be notified at the earliest opportunity"


Good Afternoon

Thank you for your email.

I can confirm your request will now be considered and you will be notified at the earliest opportunity.


Many thanks
Sue A Newman
Issue & Enforcement Team
The County Court & Family Court at Huddersfield|Queensgate House|Huddersfield|West Yorkshire|HD1 2RR| DX 703013 Huddersfield 2
Phone: 01484 421043





I am not authorised to bind my Department contractually, nor to make representations or other statements which may bind the Department in any way via electronic means.


IMPORTANT INFORMATION:

Filing of documents:

The Court requires any document[s] to be filed by one method only – either electronically or via post.

If filing via email, do so using the most appropriate email address only.

Documents filed by multiple methods and/or to multiple email accounts causes duplication of work and subsequent unnecessary delay to the service we provide.

Filing by Email:

Any email received exceeding the limit of 10MB or over 50 pages, in accordance with Procedure Rules, will not be printed and processed by the Court and you will be required to file a hard copy.

Trial bundles must not be filed electronically.

Legal Advice:

Neither the Court Staff nor the Judiciary can provide any person[s] with legal advice. You will be instructed to seek legal advice from an independent source of your own choosing.

daveiron wrote:Try complaining to the MoJ;
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/ministry-of-justice/about/complaints-procedure

or

https://www.complaints.judicialconduct.gov.uk/makeacomplaint/

Also pick out the relevant principles here,
they are in breach of 5 of the 7.
https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/the-7-principles-of-public-life/the-7-principles-of-public-life--2

Hmmmm interesting, thank you.

Edit: I have registered the complaint.

Just wondering, have you sorted out your mail delivery with the Post Office ?

Well i have just received a call from the Huddersfield county court, so after my last email was sent earlier, the recipient has not known what to do so ahs passed this to a manager (who it was that called me). Now when i submitted the request to the courts i assumed that this would go to the data controller, this is not how it works with the courts, the lady explained that the team that deal these requests are not listed publicly, and people do submit a SAR to the court email address that i did as they do not know where to send it otherwise. Then what happens is they look at the email and see what can be sent out as a SAR that's relevant and if anything further is required it goes to the support team that deal with SAR's. I did say that the process is flawed as what happens if a request is missed and doesn't end up with the support team, and also why do they decide what is relevant in a SAR as i requested all information that they hold on me. She did say that they could send me a copy of the details (sent by the claimant) what i should have received but there would be a fee for this, i wasn't happy at this as i should not be paying a fee for information that i should have received for free in the first place. Her response was that the information should have been sent by the claimant and the NCC so therefore it is not themselves that have made any errors. Also.....i explained that i needed the calls or call logs as when i initially contacted NCC to request this information, they took me though screening and had a different postcode to what mine was. She then gave me the postcode that they had on file and it was incorrect, so this is why i have received no documents regarding this, again the lady did say that this is the error of the claimant and not them. Now she was helpful to be fair and she was not in the office and would be back on Monday, she has offered to call me then and go through what files they have, what i don't have and what they can give me under the SAR ( i assumed that i am entitled to everything) ok so Monday hopefully i will have all the information i need, once i have this and armed with the fact that they had an incorrect postcode, how would i go about having this returned to the courts? i just want to make sure i am airtight with all the errors that have happened.

daveiron wrote:Just wondering, have you sorted out your mail delivery with the Post Office ?

I have raised an issue with the Post Office and included the proof that i used with the courts, i have received an email to say my email has been received but we shall see what happens. I have also sent this via recorded mail.

I received this on 21.08 and responded to say that i would like a copy of this information, surprise surprise i received no response and have again today responded (this really is an absolute joke of a system, they can just ignore me at will yet continue to deduct monies from my salary (which is now causing financial issues), if and when i get this information , do i simply submit an N56 (correctly) stating that the postcode was incorrect and this was provided by the claimant which explains why i did not receive any paperwork, and also a section explaining why the monies are not owed? Please help as i need to get this submitted ASAP before they deduct more money.