Re: what is an estoppal?

by **assassin** Fri Nov 12, 2021 2:25 am

I would suggest stating the following:

They have been constantly advised that I would settle any outstanding accounts I may owe if sufficient proof required by current legislation was provided. To date they have failed to provide this full information and this judgement cannot stand as it is a fraudulent judgement and whoever made this determination was not in possession of the full facts, this is unlawful and further action may be taken against the person making this determination based on incomplete facts.

by sharman Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:01 am

thank you for the suggestion, very kind. I am filling in the form today.

by sharman Fri Nov 12, 2021 11:23 am

flyingfish wrote:This is a formal process, you use the generic application form N244 ..
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/953577/n244-eng.pdf
I suggest contacting the court who sent the judgement to confirm where to send your application. They can also confirm any fee and if you are able to apply for fee remission. Most of the form is self explanatory but just ask if you need any specific guidance. Question 3 the order you're applying for is to set aside judgement in default. The "meat" goes into question 10 where you include the reason for not responding (out of the country etc), and an outline of your proposed defence.

I attempted to contact the court to enquire... I was 55 in the queue and calling an 0300 number from france... so I will read the ccj carefully and send where they say...

by sharman Tue Dec 07, 2021 9:56 pm

sharman wrote:
flyingfish wrote:This is a formal process, you use the generic application form N244 ..
https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/953577/n244-eng.pdf
I suggest contacting the court who sent the judgement to confirm where to send your application. They can also confirm any fee and if you are able to apply for fee remission. Most of the form is self explanatory but just ask if you need any specific guidance. Question 3 the order you're applying for is to set aside judgement in default. The "meat" goes into question 10 where you include the reason for not responding (out of the country etc), and an outline of your proposed defence.

I attempted to contact the court to enquire... I was 55 in the queue and calling an 0300 number from france... so I will read the ccj carefully and send where they say...

Hi guys, trusting all is well with you in these crazy days? I sent the N244 with asking that they set aside judgement stating "i have consistently advised that I would settle any outstanding accounts they claim I owe, if sufficient proof required by current legislation was provided. To date H (the interloper) have failed to provide this full information. I had to go overseas and did not receive the claim letter that resulted in this judgement." my form was returned as i inadvertently failed to date the cheque (oops)

My question now (as I am getting ready to return the N244 with dated cheque) is this:

I have gone through all my paperwork, admissable as evidence, and I wonder if i should give a chronological list of the correspondence?

They ask: 'what information will you be relying on in support of your application? there are three options: 1. attached witness statement 2. the statement of case or 3. the evidence set out in the box below

so I was thinking 3rd option. then listing the evidence in date order... 'notice of conditional acceptance' 'my letter requiring verification of claim' 'my rebuttal' 'their claim letter' "my cease and desist notice" 'their acknowledgment with no rebuttal to my claim of their tacit acceptance" etc

i had already fielded one claim letter, this ccj came about after a second claim letter was sent, which I missed, and my cease and desist notice.

Do I want a hearing? or do I want them to just 'set aside' the judgement?

I am endlessly gratful for your kind attention in this matter. I am doing everything I can to empower everyone i meet with this information.

by sharman Tue Dec 07, 2021 9:57 pm

I'd like to take them to the small claims court for wasting my time and addressing me as MRS XXX XXXXX (when i told them not to, and that it would cost them if they did) and damaging my credit rating. Can I do that?

by flyingfish Wed Dec 08, 2021 11:51 am

I think I'd prefer an attached witness statement. However I would keep it brief. Make sure to set out clearly how the judgement in default came about, how you did not receive the initial claim form and therefore did not have the opportunity to make your defence. Then outline what your defence will be.

by sharman Wed Dec 08, 2021 12:00 pm

flyingfish wrote:I think I'd prefer an attached witness statement. However I would keep it brief. Make sure to set out clearly how the judgement in default came about, how you did not receive the initial claim form and therefore did not have the opportunity to make your defence. Then outline what your defence will be.

thank you. and my defense is that i've consistently corresponded with H. and HC. and give a chronological list of key docs? that i had already received a claim form in 2020 and my requirement for evidence of contract was not met. Ending with the maxim "he who makes the claim has the burden of proof" ?

Also... do I want a hearing? or do I just want them to set the judgment aside? and if they do set aside, what happens then?

by sharman Mon Dec 20, 2021 7:21 pm

Good day to you fine men and women of the land... So to continue this saga, i sent an N244 asking for judgement to be set aside.. listing a brief chronology of the correspondence and stating i did not receive their claim letter due to being called overseas.

The company that bought the debt, the Debt Collector, have contacted my asking to see evidence that i was at the foreign address at that time. I have evidence. Do i supply this evidence to the DC? or do i wait for the court to respond first?

by **assassin** Thu Dec 23, 2021 4:23 am

Its not for you to prove anything to them as its their job to disprove your claim, basically they are on a fishing trip and getting desperate in finding anything they can to use against you. Your only requirement is to prove to the court and not the company.

They play upon your ignorance and take your response and try to manipulate it into something it isn't, only correspond with the court and bring this issue up that they are still trying to contact you even though it is now a court matter, the court has the obligation to provide them with your paperwork now; this could also constitute harassment.

If you don't answer their questions you cannot incriminate yourself and that is what they are hoping for so write back to them and inform them it is in the hands of the court and if they continue to try contacting you it will be deemed as harassment and it will be passed to the court in evidence.

by sharman Thu Dec 23, 2021 9:10 am

assassin wrote:Its not for you to prove anything to them as its their job to disprove your claim, basically they are on a fishing trip and getting desperate in finding anything they can to use against you. Your only requirement is to prove to the court and not the company.

They play upon your ignorance and take your response and try to manipulate it into something it isn't, only correspond with the court and bring this issue up that they are still trying to contact you even though it is now a court matter, the court has the obligation to provide them with your paperwork now; this could also constitute harassment.

If you don't answer their questions you cannot incriminate yourself and that is what they are hoping for so write back to them and inform them it is in the hands of the court and if they continue to try contacting you it will be deemed as harassment and it will be passed to the court in evidence.

Thank you for the clarification. I also received a notice from the county court Biz Centre of Transfer of Proceedings to Leeds, (from Northampton) 'for the court to deal with the defendant's application for an order to set judgment aside. but there is no contact address for Leeds. why d'you think they did that. They finish with "the court will send you and the other party notice of the time and date of your hearing". When i filled out the N244 i ticked 'no hearing' just for it to be set aside. They cashed my cheque. Robbers.

at the end of the notice in tiny tiny print it says 'check if you can issue your claim on line... go to www.MONEYCHAIN.gov.uk to find out more.... well that just about says it all.. the gov has a money chain and shackles and cuffs. Criminals.

by flyingfish Thu Dec 23, 2021 2:44 pm

The hearing should just be to decide whether or not to grant your set aside application. I guess the claimant objected or disputed your grounds, and that's why a hearing is being set.

by sharman Thu Dec 23, 2021 4:45 pm

flyingfish wrote:The hearing should just be to decide whether or not to grant your set aside application. I guess the claimant objected or disputed your grounds, and that's why a hearing is being set.

would i be expected to be present?

by flyingfish Thu Dec 23, 2021 5:08 pm

Yes, so you can put your case. Otherwise it will just be the judge, and the claimant explaining why it shouldn't be set aside.

by sharman Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:44 pm

Halo there, dearest brothers and sisters. A remote hearing, by phone, has been set for this case. coming up in the next week (they kindly gave me 10 days to get my bundle together and email it over to them. Thanks to you guys it was relatively easy to scan in the chronologically ordered documents to outline my defense. I'm including the one way ferry booking that meant I was not in the country to receive the 2nd claim letter. I had already successfully dealt with one claim letter with your help, thank you. The last communication I had with the 3rd party interlopers was to say i would not be responding to any more letters unless they were signed by a man or woman.

My father in law has read through my bundle, of 25 pages which includes all their responses and claims and my rebuttals and notices. He says the bottom line is that they never provided evidence of contract, so that's the end of it. What do you guys think?

any hints and tips about how i am to behave during the hearing? words or phrases I should or shouldn't use? very grateful for your input.

Maxim in law "He who makes the claim has the burden of proof" will be included in my covering letter. i'd like to say " I command the court to remove this judgement as it was fraudulently obtained" and in one of my previous notices I listed as a requirement that they remove any negative comments from my credit history. Can I ask for this to be enforced?

I have so many questions... in one of my early letters, i wrote "if you address me as MRS BBBBBBB BBBB in capitals, you agree to pay £5000" This statement they never rebutted or ever mentioned, then they proceeded to address me as MRS... in caps for every subsequent communication. When is it correct to bring this up and make my own claim?

by sharman Wed Jan 26, 2022 11:37 am

COURT HEARING in a few days... any hints and tips about how i am to behave during the hearing? words or phrases I should or shouldn't use? very grateful for your input.

by flyingfish Wed Jan 26, 2022 4:24 pm

Is the hearing solely to decide your set aside application? Or are we past that stage and this is now a hearing for the claim itself?

by sharman Wed Jan 26, 2022 4:42 pm

I asked for the claim to be set aside as I did not receive the claim letter due to being abroad at the time. I was going to include all the correspondence and my one way ferry ticket and Carte de Sejour (right to live in France with my address on it)

by sharman Fri Feb 04, 2022 2:01 pm

Judgement set aside. The judge said "the defendant does have a reasonable prospect of success" he allowed the application. I now have 21 days to file a full defense to be heard in front of another judge. I need to find the form "acknowledgment of service and defece"

They asked how to address me. I said by my first name, they asked for something more formal, i told them they may call me master xxxxx, which they did.

I have found this form. "Application for judgment in default of filing an acknowledgment of service and/or defence or collision statement of case" Is it the right one? If anyone can point me in the right direction of how to proceed with filling it in and outlining my defense, i'd be very grateful. I thought i had already done that when giving information on the N244 to have the judgement set aside. they weave a tangled web.

last night i was reading the bible, at my book mark, and on the very page I happened to be on I read Luke Ch11,v52 "woe unto you lawyers for ye have taken away the key of knowledge: ye entered not in yourselves, and them that were entering in ye hindered" AND Luke Ch12,v11 and v12 "and when they bring you unto the synagogues and magistrates, and powers, take ye no thought how or what thing ye shall answer, or what ye shall say" "For the Holy Ghost shall teach you in the same hour what ye ought to say" It made me laugh out loud. timing. this forum is my holy ghost, though without prior study and knowledge i would have been lost at the hearing.

by flyingfish Fri Feb 04, 2022 4:02 pm

That is an excellent result. Sounds like you handled it well, and maybe the judge was fair as well. I don't know if the claimant tried to nit-pick over your defence as they sometimes do, but if so then they clearly didn't get their way.

The form you mention "Application for judgment in default ..." would be what the claimant would have used. It's not relevant for you.

Regarding your defence, what you needed to show at this stage was that it is a defence worth considering. For this full hearing you have the opportunity to refine and/or expand the points that you raised in your N244.

by sharman Fri Feb 04, 2022 4:08 pm

thank you for the clarification. How do I present my defence? as a word document? or is there a special form i need to fill in? d'you know? and should I send it to the court where I just had the virtual hearing recently. Also am i expected to pay any more.

by sharman Fri Feb 04, 2022 4:30 pm

sharman wrote:Judgement set aside. The judge said "the defendant does have a reasonable prospect of success" he allowed the application. I now have 21 days to file a full defense to be heard in front of another judge.

I'd greatly appreciate any guidance @assassin @Mrblue2015 @daveiron

by sharman Fri Feb 04, 2022 4:49 pm

The defence I gave at this hearing is as follows:
The claimant wrote to me very early on stating that this alleged debt came from "an original agreement with xxxxx bank that was subsequently terminated". So if the bank and the claimant chose to enter into agreement it is none of my business.

Secondly they ignored all my notices to provide evidence of contract.

Thirdly the claim that resulted in the CCJ was the second identical claim, I had already dealt with the first claim a year before hand.

I would also like to counter claim. Is this possible? They have caused harm to me by way of wasting my time, threatening me and costing me court fees.

by **daveiron** Fri Feb 04, 2022 10:55 pm

If you sent the 3 NoCA and they did not respond with point by point
answers .That should form the main part of your defence. Its important
to stress that you at no point refused to pay any lawful obligation you
may have. You asked for validation of alleged debt.
The questions asked are very important ,For example do they hold the
original agreement (security) if not where is it and who is the 'holder in
due course'
I hope you studied and fully comprehended the route because the questions
you need to ask should be obvious.

There has been no refusal,therefor no controvsey for a court to make judgment
upon.

by **Mrblue2015** Sat Feb 05, 2022 8:31 am

Well put DaveIron.

by flyingfish Sat Feb 05, 2022 9:39 am

sharman wrote:Thirdly the claim that resulted in the CCJ was the second identical claim, I had already dealt with the first claim a year before hand.

I didn't notice this before. Was it exactly the same particulars of claim, same value, same claimant? Or differing in detail but arising from the same alleged account? Either way this could be useful. We need to have a look into this, there are some circumstances where this would be an absolute bar.

I would also like to counter claim. Is this possible? They have caused harm to me by way of wasting my time, threatening me and costing me court fees.

You can counter claim, but what you describe is probably better dealt with by claiming your costs. Costs can include your time preparing your defence as well as attending hearings, you can either claim by proving your loss (balance of probabilities) or by using the default LIP rate of £18.00 per hour. Any fees you had to pay could also be claimed as costs.

Just to double check, going by the value you gave earlier, this isn't a Small Claim?

Did you receive a written order following the set aside? If so then I would expect that to include directions regarding submitting defences.

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