DSAR

daveiron wrote:You could if you wish start the NoCA route.  

I personally split their responces into 2 seperate files;
1 Everything to & from the CEO in 1 folder
2 Everything from a minion in another .

You will no doubt find folder 1 will only contain your notices etc as the CEO
is very unlikely to respond.

Folder 2 will contain all the BS and distraction from the minions. i just rebut
these and inform them the matter is being dealt with privately with the CEO.

Thanks daveiron. I figured I would give it a couple weeks before responding so as to draw it out a bit longer. How long does the mail tennis go on for with these guys until it gets given to the DCA? I guess it depends on how they are feeling.

I would now expect a debt collector to contact you anytime now,but dont
be suprised if when you get rid or one ,another one will pop up.
Just remember they are nothing at all to worry about ,just third party interlopers.

Treat it as a learning experience.

Thanks as always for your advice.

Here is my latest letter from them.

I did not reply to the previous one yet.

But was going to start NoCA and add a bit in at the beginning about them having enough info to give me my DSAR and how they have already
breached.

Send this or similar, From this point onwards EVERYTHING must be in
writing.

To xxxxxxxx

date xxxxxxx


Notice to Agent is Notice to Principal
Notice to Principal is Notice to Agent


NOTICE-TO-CEASE-AND-DESIST.


I require you with immediate effect to Cease and Desist your contacts to me
by any means other than via Royal Mail.
You have been advised on several occasions that all  communication must
be via Royal Mail only,you have chosen to ignore my requests.
Therefore you are now put on Notice that should you continue and ignore
this Notice ,I will deem your actions to constitute harassment and  additional
complaints will be submitted to the ICO .

Please be aware this is a Notice .It is not a complaint and should not be dealt with
as such.

                                                             
                                                                                       By :   (sign here )
                                                                                            all rights reserved


                                                                           john . Henry :doe

                                      agent and representative for JOHN HENRY .DOE


Implied admission by lack of response and compliance. All contacts recorded.

Thanks daveiron. Should I also send the 1st NoCA along with this?

The keep referencing that they cannot give my dsar due to security but what else would they need to get over the telephone that they do not already have from the dsar request?

Maybe an idea to first see if they comply with the notice,then if they
comply with the DSAR, as its always good to see what they have.

They keep referencing their security policy. Their policy does not overide
their statutory obligation. They have your name & address ,which they have
used to contact you .I presume all the letters from them were sent to the
address you have provided. I note those letters were marked private & personal
in which case they should (a) not have sent them or (b) comply with your DSAR
they cannot have it both ways.

Thanks Daveiron, I am putting together my next notice. It includes my first NoCA and Cease and Desist in one notice - or should they be seperate. (Obviously you are familiar with these.)
I have also included my response to their response, to make it more individual but perhaps I am stirring the pot too much? Please let me know


Dear CEO ,

I have received two letters dated X and X. I am quite concerned regarding your constant reference to a “complaint” which has never been made. All I have done is: make a DSAR, which is my legal right under GDPR and data protection laws and then further write to you to inform via legal notice that I reported your non compliance and breaches to the Information Commissioner’s Office. The letter you sent on X is nonsensical in that it seems to acknowledge everything I wrote by writing what I wrote to you back to me in bullet points, for example, that it wasn’t a complaint, that I had reported X Bank to the ICO and that X Bank had failed to comply with regulations. But then in the next paragraph  x Bank continues to refer to my ‘complaint,’ as if you had not acknowledged any of it at all.

I am also very concerned that despite your breaches of GDPR and Data Protection Laws, you are continuing to ignore my DSAR which is well overdue. I can only assume that you have no information on me as you are unable to provide any data or, if you had any previously, it is no longer in your possession which would be a further breach of the regulations.

You keep referring to your security policy but that does not override your statutory obligation to respond with my data when adequate information in the request is provided, such as those requested on your DSAR form on the website. You have my name, address, my date of birth as specified in my DSAR, what more do you expect over the telephone? Especially as my health condition means that I am not able to communicate verbally and you have never met me personally. You have used the name and address in the DSAR to contact me, I note that these letters were marked ‘private and confidential,’ in which case if you were concerned about security on the account then you should not have sent them but as you did send private and confidential information to that name and address in the DSAR then you should also have complied with the DSAR. You cannot have it both ways.

Therefore, as you appear to have no data on me, I am perplexed as to your continuing assumption that I owe a debt to your corporation. This assumption I hereby rebut in its entirety. However, as I have always wished to stand in honour in this matter, and due to the seriousness of the assumption on your corporation’s part, I have conducted considerable research into this matter and as a result I require clarification regarding your claims, which is why I previously made a DSAR which you have not fulfilled. Your inability to provide any date  makes any claim you have against me unsubstantiated.

Therefore, to make it easier for you, I will set out the specific information I require.

Please be aware this is not a refusal to pay any lawful obligation I may have and
therefore there is not controversy. Please be aware the following is not a letter, it is a
notice and should be treated as such.

Notice of  Conditional Acceptance

This is an offer to settle any lawful obligation I may have to your corporation conditional upon your required response to the questions below to my complete satisfaction.  

Does X Bank hold or have in its possession the original agreement herein called 'the note’ Please answer under your personal liability.

If you hold the ‘note,’ please kindly forward a 'True or Certified copy' for my inspection. In addition, please provide the name of the man or woman who has first hand knowledge and attests to its authenticity under their full personal liability.

Do you deny that the 'note' is a Bill of exchange / security / promissory note / negotiable instrument. Please answer under your personal liability.

If you have confirmed that question 3 is correct, do you deny that if such note was deposited with X Bank and therefore I became a creditor of Tesco Bank and as per the judgement made by The Master of The Rolls Lord Denning who stated in a precedent High Court judgement; “We have repeatedly said in this court that a Bill of Exchange or Promissory Note is to be treated as cash, It is to be honoured unless there is some good reason to the contrary” Lord Denning M.R. In Fielding & Platt V Selim Najjar [1969] 1 W.I.R.357 at 361;[1969]2 ALL E.R. 150,CA. Please answer under your personal liability.

Do you deny that if the alleged 'note' was deposited with xxxxx Bank xxxxx Bank, then as confirmed by the Bank of England statement (quarterly bulletin 2014 Q1), “Created money out of thin air,” thereby creating a deposit in the banks ledger to the face value of said 'note' . Please answer under your full personal liability.

Do you deny that as xxxx Bank created  the money ,they incurred no material loss? Please answer under your full personal liability.

Please confirm that X Bank has not: 1. sold or traded in any way the ‘note.’ 2 Has not made an insurance claim in regards to said ‘note.' 3. That X Bank has not claimed a 'write off' to HMRC in regards to alleged defaulted account. Please answer under your full personal liability.

Please provide evidence that X Bank provided full disclosure.

Please confirm that if you have answered the above points to my satisfaction you will by arrangement, make available at a branch of my choice the original ‘note,' in its original condition, free from any endorsements or any other markings in order that said 'note' will upon payment of alleged sum owing, exchange be made for said note, in order that I may cancel or destroy it.

Chirographum apud debitorem repertum praesumitur solutum . A deed or bond found with the debtor is presumed to be paid.
         
Semper necessitas probandi incumbit qui agit. The claimant is always bound to prove: the burden of proof lies on him .

NOTICE-TO-CEASE-AND-DESIST

I require you with immediate effect to Cease and Desist your contacts with me by any means other than via Royal Mail. You have been advised this on several occasions that all communication must be via Royal Mail. You have chosen to ignore my requests. Therefore you are now put on Notice that should you continue to ignore this notice, I will deem you actions to constitute harrassment and additional complaints will be submitted to the ICO.

Please be aware this is a Notice. It is not a complaint and should not be dealt with as such.

                                                                                                               
                                                                                          Yours sincerely

                                                                                  By;    
                                                                                         
  all rights reserved
                                                    john henry :Doe
                      Authorised  representative for JOHN HENRY DOE

Non negotiable . All contacts recorded

Looks good,(dont forget to put bank name where you have x)
Dont forget to clearly write Notice of Conditional Acceptance at the top

Do you have the CEOs name & HO address,if not find it on Companies House
or Company Check.

Start it : To (ceo full name) The man acting as Chief Executive Officer.
Dont use full capitols for his name, you are writing to the living man not his
fiction. & put Private and Confidential at the begining.

Just one more thing ,your name etc at the bottom should always be on the
right hand side ,that is the side of the creditor (you) and if you can ,try to
get your signature overlaping all rights reserved.

Its good to see someone putting in the effort.

daveiron wrote:Looks good,(dont forget to put bank name where you have x)
Dont forget to clearly write Notice of Conditional Acceptance at the top

Do you have the CEOs name & HO address,if not find it on Companies House
or Company Check.

Start it : To (ceo full name) The man acting as Chief Executive Officer.
Dont use full capitols for his name, you are writing to the living man not his
fiction. & put Private and Confidential at the begining.

Just one more thing ,your name etc at the bottom should always be on the
right hand side ,that is the side of the creditor (you) and if you can ,try to
get your signature overlaping all rights reserved.

Its good to see someone putting in the effort.

Thanks, I have all the CEO info and will do that with the signature.

Do I put my name. XXXXX :XXXX or just as the name I have previously written to them as, which is the name on the account?

I always do it as above.

Does that mean I would not put my name and address in the top right hand corner as I have done in all previous notices?

Put your address at the top as per the templates.
Its also preferable to number the questions ,again as per the templates.

Where you write "GDPR and Data Protection Laws" it might be an idea to quote the exact legislation which is the "Data Protection Act 2018".  For clarity GDPR set out the rules that need to be in place within every part of the EU (as we were at that time), so you have every right to expect them to comply with GDPR.  However the UK law that compels them is that Data Protection Act 2018.

It's quibbling a bit, but it shows you know what's what and aren't just quoting from some third hand information.

i agree

i always end with the following too:

I remind you, concealment of my data is a criminal offence pursuant s.173 (3) Data Protection Act 2018 and s.3 Fraud Act 2006.

Thanks for that waylander, I have filed it for future reference.

I have gotten a response from the ICO. Very unhelpful.

They say that "under the data protection law that you are not entitled to receive information relating to fraudulent activity on your account. They are not obligated under the data protection law to provide any information about the fraudster as it would not be considered your personal information."

They then say they are satisfied with the OCs response.

Well how could I possibly verify whether I owe anything if I cannot see any paperwork. I expect the OCs next reply to my NoCA to be about fraud and complaints. I might just send NoCA 2, but also as suggest that there may actually be fraud because I definitely never signed anything and there is no proof that i did to jog my memory!

What do you think?

Send NoCA 2 10 days from notice 1.

So they have told the ICO there is fraud involved in the account, and the ICO
have said the fraudsters info is not yours ?

Stick with the notices as they are an offer of remedy and you are not refusing
payment.

Maybe a good idea to put the quote from waylander somewhere near the top
of your next notice.

I remind you, concealment of my data is a criminal offence pursuant s.173 (3) Data Protection Act 2018 and s.3 Fraud Act 2006.

brownowl wrote:I have gotten a response from the ICO. Very unhelpful.

They say that "under the data protection law that you are not entitled to receive information relating to fraudulent activity on your account. They are not obligated under the data protection law to provide any information about the fraudster as it would not be considered your personal information."

They then say they are satisfied with the OCs response.

Well how could I possibly verify whether I owe anything if I cannot see any paperwork. I expect the OCs next reply to my NoCA to be about fraud and complaints. I might just send NoCA 2, but also as suggest that there may actually be fraud because I definitely never signed anything and there is no proof that i did to jog my memory!

What do you think?

i dont understand this response from the ICO ? and i would certainly not leave it at that, they are satisfied with the OC's response ? which response was that ? the one sent to you or the one they may have sent to the ICO.

when have you requested information about 'the fraudster' and what about YOUR personal information ?

again when have you requested information about fraudulent activity on your account ? and again what about your personal data ?

never LET THESE SO CALLED 'REGULATORS' GET AWAY WITH THEIR BULLSH*T , respond to the ICO and ask them to explain about i) fraudulent activity ii) fraudster as you have no idea what they are referring to. your request was simple and requested your personal dat a from the OC. simple as that.

Thanks,

It seems that the ICO contacted the OC and the OC said that there was fraud on the account and so they can't give me my information.

Fraud was never reported on my account, but I suspect they are saying they have tried to call me to tell me there is fraud on the account. They could also write this to me but they haven't but they have tried to justify not giving me my information because of the so-called fraud. They are the fraudsters?

It is quite possible that someone who isn't me could have created a credit card account using my information. In which case they should stop harrassing me.

Thanks for the help, will send NoCA in a week - Should I request information about this fraudster to the OC, since they have referred to it a couple of times and so has the ICO?

I will also write direct to the ICO.

Personally i would send the NoCA in a week. Get back to the ICO with
a letter embracing what waylander has posted. I would not bother mentioning
the fraud aspect to the OC at this stage.

agree with Dave, dont mention fraud to the OC at this time however what i did find interesting is what you said ?

Should I request information about this fraudster to the OC, since they have referred to it a couple of times

can you explain what you mean here ?

waylander62 wrote:agree with Dave, dont mention fraud to the OC at this time however what i did find interesting is what you said ?

Should I request information about this fraudster to the OC, since they have referred to it a couple of times

can you explain what you mean here ?

Yes, earlier responses from the OC they twice said they couldn't give me my personal information as it would jeopardise any fraud investigations. I wasn't aware of any fraud. They said they tried to call me but I did not answer. But I guess they are just using that as an excuse. But that is what they must have told the ICO.

I put in NoCA I want a reply in 21days. I guess there is no harm in that and then switch to 10days on NoCA 2.

would be a good idea to get the ICO to put in writing that the OC are looking into a fraud investigation.

cover yourself.

Nice touch Waylander62