Joint Bank Giro Credit Slip Missing Utility Company Has Not sent with their fake bill/s Need advice please .

Seems Utility Companies are changing their tactics by sending Bank Giro Credit Slip/s rather than Joint Bank Giro Credit Slip/s which contain The Corporate Bank Details and word/ logo 'Transcash ' This is obviously a ploy to try to stop us 'paying lawfully ' by 'paying by Endorcement ' using The JBGCS .
Need advice Please . The Bank Giro Credit Slips / BGCS I have been sent do however have 'The barcode on them ' ? I don't want to talk directly to Scottish Power SP would rather email but unsure How I should proceed , as now have DCA involved ..Any advice would be appreciated .
Thanks in advance .

Write to them asking for a "new bill" with the forementioned joint giro slip. If & when it goes to court so long as you have kept a "record of the parties" - the correspondence between you & utility Co then you have a record of asking for appropriate "bills" to be sent for a NON COMMERCIAL CUSTOMER. You can show you have been trying to seek/give remedy for the aledged debt.

Dear Sir/Madam,

After receiving from you a Bill for £XXX.XX I notice a normal bank giro slip has been attached, I require a Bill with a Joint Giro Credit Slip attached for a NON COMMERCIAL CUSTOMER.

Yours...

or words to that effect!

Someone else may be able to put it better than I have! - Good Luck!

Hi

Sorry, i've yet to try endorsing so i can't add anything to LionsShare's contribution.

i just have a question:

Is it at all possible that the difference between a joint Giro (non-commercial) and a bank Giro (commercial) is how much the recipient gets paid? And maybe from which fund?

Perhaps if you endorse a joint Giro they get paid the amount on the 'bill', whereas if you endorse a bank Giro (as commercial remedy) they may be paid 3X the value of the bill?

After all, if you are signing as a person you can be taken several ways.....

Cheers!

hi iamani,

not too sure how much they get paid. The only thing I know is the commercial instrument when endorsed is or at least discharging the alleged bill.

Also try endorsement - real fun.  

Hi LionsShare

It sure sounds like fun, and if i ever receive such a bill i'll be sure to try it!

What i'm getting at at (i think) is the difference between 'exemption' and 'redemption'.......

Cheers!

iamani wrote:Hi LionsShare

It sure sounds like fun, and if i ever receive such a bill i'll be sure to try it!

If you pay by DD then cancel the DD, you will receive something!

I just want to say a few words about the utility companies and their so-called bills. Firstly, they are not bills, but then most of us realise this by now. Secondly, there is no money. This country and every single corporation in it are in bankruptcy, therefore there is only debt, debt currency, money or whatever you choose to call it. The so-called money that you think you have stashed away under the mattress, in a bank or building society, is not yours and certainly not money. So, no matter what you may think, you cannot PAY for anything, you can only set off a debt.

Utility companies have played this game for so long that they believe that what they are doing is correct and lawful/legal, whichever one it is. The joint giro credit slip that they send to you is most certainly not a bill, it's a statement. They cannot send you a true bill simply because as men/women we own the gas/water/electricity that we use. The utility statements are being sent merely to indicate how much they own to us under the Human Rights declaration, but as there is no money, we cannot bank it, only set it off as an A4V. If we pay, like good little slaves, then they are paid 3 times. Once by the commercial Banks, secondly by us via the post office or bank with our hard earned cash(tongue in cheek), thirdly through our signature and our trust fund, remember, for the latter our signature turns the bill into a negotiable instrument/security.

Returning to the subject of settling our so-called debts, I have tried the joint giro credit way for quite some time now, in fact since it was first suggested...it doesn't work! They just bloody well ignore these credit slips. I see only one means to settling these debts once and for all...A4V.

Now, I've seen that many so-called methods of doing A4V that my head is spinning with all the BS. I cannot help but notice that since GOODF shut down and this forum took over, we no longer appear to cover those good oldies, A4V and Promissory Notes. I know that Ceylon remarked several times that A4V no longer work as they did in the past, but failed to mention how they did work when they did? I am absolutely sure that A4V is the only means to settling in this bankrupt world that we all live in.

So, which way to make an A4V is the correct method? I have been told that it has to be done through the HMRC because it comes under taxable liabilities? If I can see a response that appears that it should give positive results, then I'm going to use this from now onwards....Ideas on a postcard please...

Hi LL,

long time no see! how are you?

how have you got on with pay by endorse thing? the last we "spoke" I think you may have been well down this road but not at the court stage?

me am on to 2nd or 3rd dca, have been sent numerous demands for payment but no proof. Have even sent to gas Co an "offer" to establish a dialog to settle their dispute, but nothing yet, may give it 1 more chance & just wait!

Others have started to go through court but as yet no one posts what has happened to them. It would be interesting to know!

All the best LS

Hi LionsShare, I haven't been online much since I became ill during late summer, but I'm thankfully okay now, thanks for asking.

The pay by endorsement quite simply Doesn't Work! The utility co's are willing to go to court simply because they know that you, the strawman to whom the so-called bills are addresses, will pay through the nose eventually. The so-called courts are working together with the companies and accept the agent's word in court as being gospel. I do not believe for one moment that anyone has actually had their bills paid by endorsement successfully, this despite what they may say. I've been in touch with one of them a while ago and they clam up when asked if it worked for them. One can play this game for a couple of years, since they, the companies can put in a better court case when the so-called fiat money owed racks up high enough to make a case that will go against you and it will stick. Think about it!

I've had enough of playing their numpty games, but I'm not saying anything more than my hand has been tipped and the buck stops here. My advice, for what it's worth, don't waste your time with Pay by Endorsement. However, I do admit that within some courts, company agents will capitulate, but those that do are almost as rare as hen's teeth.

Hi

landlubber - how sure are you that you were following the correct prescribed procedure? (and i'm not saying i know what that is, coz i have yet to learn it).

Cheers!

Hi iamani,

You've hit the nail on the head, so to speak. I cannot be sure that I was following the prescribed procedure, simply because the companies are bending the rules according to those set by the world banks. Remember, there is no money and we men/women are the only creators of money in this mixed up world of ours. Technically, as we're all living in bankruptcy, we are entitled to have our debts settled since there is no real money to settle with. When governments took all the gold, they should have given us a means to settle our debts and they did! It's just that they would rather, the world banks, have us remain in debt for all time.

Hi landlubber

Well i don't know as much as you and LionsShare do, so can't offer anything worthwhile on the subject.

But i've just watched a vid that might interest you (and everyone else).

Go to YT and enter 'subrogation'. There's a vid posted by a guy named Tj, 17/11/17 i think. About 20mins long, very interesting info (even a bit of equity).

Cheers!

Hi LL,

Glad to see you are OK.

Yes I concur about A4V but as you say if Ceylon says it don't work no more with out explaining that does make things difficult. Again agree it would be nice to see or go back to some old stuff that was on the old site.

landlubber wrote:So, which way to make an A4V is the correct method? I have been told that it has to be done through the HMRC because it comes under taxable liabilities? If I can see a response that appears that it should give positive results, then I'm going to use this from now onwards....Ideas on a postcard please...

May be 1 way is to send all utility bills, ctax etc., & give it to the council. Have not actually tried it do you or anyone know if it has been tried?

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/Vict/51-52/41/section/79

79 Incorporation of county council.

(2)All duties and liabilities of the inhabitants of a county shall become and be duties and liabilities of the council of such county.

Agree with other comments about how we are all effectively stuffed & done over - there is no doubt!

For me though I have come this far, responses form gas Co & dca(s) totally inane, 1 even went on about paying with prom notes when I had only pay by endorsement! Yes its all corrupt but for me must push on to see the end  - indeed if there is an end possibly the 6 year statute limit, but then the accmulative time in between.

Hi Iamani - watched that vid & it looks like effectively challenging jurisdiction? I do have some saved pages off the old site I could share if interested on what others say they have done!

Hi

LionsShare - challenging jurisdiction is indeed a fun topic, but i think that vid is more about asserting your correct status in court, and flipping (rather than challenging) jurisdiction from commerce into equity. They bring your BC to court as a bond to use against you, you basically claim the bond as your own, which makes it YOUR court as man/beneficiary, and you authorise them to use the bond to set off your obligations in this case. Brilliant!

i'll check my YT history for the title just in case we watched different vids. i can imagine us getting into a long thread about how we saw the vid differently and it turning out to be different vids!
(Edit: 'Stop a court case with one question - right to subrogation')

Your extract : 2)All duties and liabilities....etc. actually describes - and very well, i might add - the role of a trustee imo.

It made me think of debt-less' posts. All so called contracts with utilities, councils and cc companies are actually trust relationships in which they should be acting as trustees to us the OC's.

When you suggested sending them all to the council, you might not be far off.

i'm beginning to suspect that the likes of endorsements and A4V's might come under the umbrella of equity.

If one seeks to invoke equity one must 'do' equity.

'Doing' equity seems to involve expressing one's will in a living trust and last will and testament.

Maybe it's the people who haven't arranged these things for themselves who have their endorsements and A4V's rejected.....?

i also watched a couple of Richard Ansah's offerings on the indigo child channel that were VERY informative - to the point were i think he may have let on more than he wished......

landlubber - stick with it buddy, or at least don't give up completely. You may only be off by a hair, who knows?

Cheers!

Hi iamani,

After reading your post that has got me thinking about that vid, as you say - trusts. I have also seen some of Richard Ansah's offerings, but will have revisit again for clarity. This has got me thinking! You are right we have seen the same vid 'Stop a court case with one question - right to subrogation'

Actually you may be right - there was that bloke  - ? Dobson (off face book) I think that always said - return ctax to council & write on it "something by settlor pay [council]..." there was more text but have forgotten. He claimed that should send a message to the council to go the  - possibly Accountant General & get paid that way - possibly with some sort of bond.

Perhaps LL if you are reading could you share some light on this? LL didn't you try something like this yourself?

Iamani - They bring your BC to court as a bond to use against you, you basically claim the bond as your own, which makes it YOUR court as man/beneficiary, and you authorise them to use the bond to set off your obligations in this case. Brilliant!

I like this very much, except that courts are crooked, here I speak about the magistrates courts. The court I know, knows very little about the actual law and I've watched the(I've forgotten what he/she is called, but it's the one that the mag relies upon for the law.) become flustered when a point of law needed verifying.

LionsShare - I've always liked that piece of legislation regarding all duties and liabilities of a council, however it has been tried on GOODF and the councils involved always returned by saying that this piece of legislation has been repealed. Of course we all know that it hasn't. However, it brings a thought to me. Councils are corporations in it for profit, they're all crooks, so what chance is there of getting them to follow their laws if they decide not to? Dobson??? No, his means to settling CT quite simply doesn't work, I know because I tried it right down to directing my claim to the correct officer(known by a number but I forget which one.)

Hi LL,

I think it was either 150 or 151 something like that!

I do agree these councils are all for profit private corps' & completely bent! enough said!

There are ammendments to that act for section 3 but it looks like section 2 is still enacted with no updated information.

Hi

landlubber - yup, they definitely seem corrupt. However, this technique is best employed (imo) in writing prior to your appearance.

When you receive an offer to appear at court tell them you will attend on condition you receive a signed letter confirming the prosecutor certifies your right to subrogation. Apparently everything goes away.

While we're at it we could bang in a SAR to the mag. of your case or the building manager of the court asking for details of any bonds with your name on, that will be used in your case, and are connected to the numbers on your BC, and your SS no. and NINo. Can't see them giving you that, and they can't deny it in writing, so........

As far as the CT goes we're just gonna have to try harder. i think the info Waffle and Candor posted over the summer has given us a better understanding of what we're up against, and the answer may be in there.

Also the debt-less posts give us another angle we have yet to fully consider, that of trusts and trustees being at the core of the problem.

LionsShare - i did see one dobson vid somewhere and it looked good, but last i heard was that his method didn't work - i don't know the truth of the matter.

The main thing i remember about the Ansah vids is that he mentions how solicitors make good trustees, and it made me wonder.....

Trustee always pays.... most if not all attacks on your trust are going to be legal, who better to have as trustee? Once he's got your power of attorney shouldn't he be able to sign and submit your endorsements and A4V's.....?

Worth thinking about at least.

Cheers!

iamani wrote:

LionsShare  - Trustee always pays.... most if not all attacks on your trust are going to be legal, who better to have as trustee? Once he's got your power of attorney shouldn't he be able to sign and submit your endorsements and A4V's.....?

Worth thinking about at least.

Yes but possibly as solicitor is member of BAR so will he not simply say "yes defendent will pay?"

Do agree though it is 1 to think about!

Hi LionsShare

Yes, that was my first thought, but after thinking some more......

A solicitor as trustee has to do his best to protect the trust. He can't just roll over, no matter his allegiance to the bar, as he leaves himself liable to prosecution for negligence.

If he says 'defendant will pay', well great! He is referring to your person - and as trustee he must pay. With his own money? No. He will use the funding of the estate in the form of an A4V or endorsement or PN. Not your hard-earned.

Plus he will be under your direction (as Executor). Conditional acceptance looks much better on a solicitors letterheaded paper, your 'creditors' may think more than twice about messing around when they know what they're up against.

We could do with more info, but i think there might be something to it.

Cheers!

Hi iamani,

I can only deduce that trust "law" could be above possibly all other "law" or that trust "law" is NOT to be messed with?

Hi LionsShare

....and trust law is of equity and ecclesia. Yes, not to be messed with, that's probably why the Executor letter works, and why subrogation once brought up (apparently) can't be swept aside.

Candor's been trying to make us see this i think, maybe he will add something....?

Cheers!

Landlubber, its the clerk to the magistrates.

LionsShare wrote:Hi iamani,

I can only deduce that trust "law" could be above possibly all other "law" or that trust "law" is NOT to be messed with?

Trust law is under common law and not criminal law, it also comes under private law as there is the settlor who puts something into trust, and this can be the agent to the settlor, there is the beneficiary which is you, and there are the trustees who are appointed to work on your behalf and for your benefit, if the magistrates hear such cases they are committing fraud from the outset as the lowest court which can hear such cases are the County Court, and any claims from any other courts such as mags, and crown courts do not have the authority to hear t.