PPI BANKRUPTCY

by memegirl777 Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:35 pm

Hi all ,
I have asked this before but here goes,

My other half has claimed PPI just before the dead line ,

he went bankrupt over 14 years ago ,

he has just had a reply saying he is owed £1,800 from one bank which we could really do with right now,

but the letter also states that it will be paid to his creditors through his trustee who he does not have a clue who that is any more ,

I have googled this and apparently it is an "unrealised asset "
so basically he could of claimed ppi at any point and paid it to the debtors according to google ,

the ppi claims company did not tell him that this was law they told me that "it does happen a lot"

this seems wrong to me because surely ppi only became an asset after the president was set in court by the first person who claimed it ?

also he knows that there is one £20,000 loan that he paid off in full that had ppi and was not part of the bankruptcy and even that will be paid to the creditors not him ,

now am I correct in that actually the loans where paid off by the banks insurers at the time ?

our problem is that for every bank coming back saying that theyre giving the money to the creditors we owe the ppi claims firm £275 we could end up owing them near £3000 .

any help on this would be greatly appreciated pale

by **daveiron** Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:04 pm

Hi ,
I have had a look around & this one seems to explain it best.
https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt-and-money/debt-solutions/bankruptcy-2/ppi-claims-after-bankruptcy/

It may be that the only option is the " No full disclosure" regarding your contract with the claims company.
As you had a contract there must be equal consideration by both parties ,you have received no consideration
which should make the contract void.
You may need to do a SAR to get a copy of your original T&C's .
If they still persist with their stance ,you could try a complaint to the regulator.

Sorry this is only clutching at straws ,but the above link seems pretty conclusive.

by Tom Bombadil Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:34 pm

I used the ombudsman at the last day. They were ultra helpful.

by memegirl777 Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:46 pm

Thank you guys Ombudsman it is then ,

All sounds very unfair to me but at least it might not cost us to of done the claims Rolling Eyes

by **Mrblue2015** Sat Sep 21, 2019 10:04 pm

Someone I knew was in a similar situation and he complained to the FOS but, unsurprisingly, they sided with the bank and PPI was not awarded even though their bankruptcy had been discharged many, many years ago.

They’re in bed together...

by waylander62 Sat Sep 21, 2019 11:58 pm

dont let the ombudsman get away with finding for the bank

also reply to the bank telling them that you refuse to allow them to pay monies to any third party

i helped someone through this earlier this year although not for bankruptcy but for a sold debt, the bank wanted to pay the debt purchaser they sold the debt to, we refused to sign the paperwork and told them no you are not, they stood their ground so we complained to FOS , naturally FOS side with bank so we told them to p*ss off too, after 6 months of writing and ripping the FOS apart a cheque suddenly arrived for the full amount from the bank , FOS have been deathly quiet too.

dont give up and dont be afraid of the FOS they are idiots at best and also clueless.

by mongoose Sun Sep 22, 2019 4:29 am

MrBlue is spot on.
Waylander - "don't let them get away with it with finding for the bank" - where is the advice there? how to stop them would be useful?

Something inconsistent here -
1) if bankruptcy was 14 years ago, discharge is usually a year so why would they still have a trustee in bancruptcy?
2) Why would ppi recovered be paid to a loan that was already paid off?
3) PPI is an asset (debtor) immediately is was missold. (accruals accounting).
4) If bancruptcy discharged 14 years ago, there are no creditors to pay as they would have cleared down on discharge.

solution - use an indemnity claim under the DD guarantee to recover monies already paid to the f*ckers based on the misselling argument and not happy with the FOS who do not applyb the law but their own pathetic reasoning. There is no time limit on these claims.

by **Mrblue2015** Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:50 am

Well done Waylander62 (again!) The bank said they had already made the PPI payment to the third party (bankruptcy firm).

To me it was always perfectly logical that it’s one thing for a bank to sell a debt on but quite another to rob you (by mis-selling PPI) and then sell those ‘stolen’ monies as well to a third party! And I told the bank that.

And dealing with the FOS on this guy’s behalf was a first time for me and when I realised (as they sided with the bank) that they were a waste of time.

I’ll see if this guy wants to pursue again and get back to you Wayander62, thank you!

by **Mrblue2015** Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:10 am

mongoose wrote:
Waylander - "don't let them get away with it with finding for the bank" - where is the advice there?

Waylander62 has a looooong history of helping people, inc myself. And he will help with further details should the original poster (or I now on behalf of this guy I know who was also screwed over by the bank and FOS) require further help.

It’s up to the original poster now (memegirl777) to ask for further details Smile

by waylander62 Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:47 am

@ mongoose

It depends on what the FOS say in their response, they will give a reason for their findings which will be the key to how you respond. Their is no magic formula for this as each case will differ, i dealt with the bank paying a 3rd party that they had sold the debt to it worked.

Bankruptcy will no doubt be a different argument however my experience says the FOS will give a simple reply stating that the bank can do this when in all likelihood it actually cant do it.

it is not an easy path and needs thought and study this could be a thread to help a lot of people as this sort of thing is commonplace, the statistics for the FOS finding in favour of the bank is very high in favour of the bank but their decision mostly goes unchallenged.

i would expect that the bank concerned have sent a letter for the customer to sign accepting the sums and accepting it be paid to a 3rd party ?

by **daveiron** Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:41 am

Very good advice from waylander.
Lets not forget however there is the matter of the claims company .We should also be looking at the
fact that should it transpire that the money will not be paid to the poster ,we need also to work on
what the poster recons will be a 3k claim from the claims company.
Of course if the poster is successful and gets all of the money returned ,then its only right that the contract should honored.

by waylander62 Sun Sep 22, 2019 11:30 am

very good point daveiron i had overlooked that

the claims company will be only too happy to let the bank pay the money to a 3rd party as they have done their job and therefore will want their 'cut'

i would NEVER EVER use a claims management company

more info. is definitely required probably starting with who is corresponding with you the bank or the claims management company ?

by **daveiron** Sun Sep 22, 2019 12:15 pm

It may be an idea to split this thread as there are clearly two issues involved.

As the ppi deadline has passed ,its going to take more digging .I have however dug up a couple ,
One from Gladstone Brookes & one from FTS ,below. The answer may lie in the wording of the contract,
I think a SAR is going to be needed to get a copy of the T&C's

No Upfront Costs

We never charge an upfront fee. Our PPI Claim fee of 20% + VAT (so 24%° of the total redress offered by your lender) is only payable if your claim is successful. That means if we don’t recover you anything, you don’t pay us a penny.

6. This Agreement contains the terms and conditions upon which FTS agrees to act in the Case on behalf of the Client on a contingency basis, so that FTS will be paid the agreed percentage of the Client’s financial benefit from the Case if the Case is concluded with the recovery to the Client of a financial benefit, or settled upon terms which include the payment to the Client of that financial benefit. FTS will receive nothing if no financial benefit is recovered.

by **assassin** Mon Sep 23, 2019 2:42 am

Lets throw a spanner into the works, and use terminology and this states that PPI payouts are COMPENSATION for the fraudulent action of mis selling PPI without disclosure.

Compensation?????? an interesting word as according to the law compensation can only be paid to the victims, and lets not forget these are victims of crime, and the only way the victims can get around this is to agree to pay it to someone else and you have to enter a contract with them on their terms and conditions, and to allow them to pay someone else.

Compensation is interesting and this is because it cannot be taxed or come into any other financial equation and even if you are on benefits you don't have to declare it because you have 1 year and 1 day to dispose of it, or 366 days in a normal year and 367 days in a leap year. After this time you do have to have spent it or declared it, or have put it into trust so it isn't yours.

by flyingfish Mon Sep 23, 2019 7:58 am

Basic questions, was the account from which PPI has been reclaimed opened after he was discharged from bankruptcy? If so then I can't see how they can possibly have a claim. If it predates the bankruptcy then maybe there's some logic in their claim, although I think it's a pretty weak one that should be disputed.

By the way some elements of a PPI claim are in fact taxable, in particular if the sum includes interest paid by the bank then that's taxable income. In fact it may well have been paid after deducting tax on that element.
Refund of PPI premiums or of interest paid are not, as these are simply giving back money that shouldn't have been taken in the first place. Regarding benefits the refund counts as savings, so both elements can have an effect.

I'd be interested to know where the "year and a day" rule comes from. I actually can't see how that would even work, for example if I receive £200 then how can anyone tell a year later whether I've spent that money or some other money.

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