Fee Schedule - services - help please

by 123 Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:56 am

Hi All!

Just wondering if anyone is able to help out with any advice on this?

I'm enquiring about using a fee schedule not in a debt collection context but breach of contract context:

A service provider hasn't delivered the service as described, and is in breach of contract. I have moved to another service provider and the first one still owes a per rata refund of annual prepaid charges. In addition they have committed a statutory offence in the process of dealing with the matter, hence I'm trying to pursue two separate claims:

Damages for breach of contract in addition to the per rata refund (they've waisted a considerable amount of time running into 50+ calls and 50+ emails within a short period of time in order to achieve a satisfactory service which never happened).
Damages for (personal) injury to feelings (based on their statutory offence)

So far I've sent two letters based on templates - the breach of contract being a complaint letter and the other one a hybrid of a letter before claim and a complaint letter.

The service provider's response has been ridiculous - trying to undercut even the per rata refund as a final offer to both claims.

What's the best way forward - still engage in a "normal response" to their complaints-reply or serving letter(s) before claim for both separately?

If I responded to their complaints-reply, what is the best way of drafting a fee schedule in order to get them to pay pre-/out of court claim?

Many thanks!

by **daveiron** Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:11 pm

Personally i would write to them (R D) informing them of their breach of contract & as they have failed perform on their contract you will now make a claim in the County Court, for the cost of your pre payment and also the costs incurred
in dealing with their communications which have proved to be nothing more than a waste of your time.
Inform them that your time has a value & you do not work for free. Inform them you have made every effort to resolve this matter .

Draw up a list of your costs e.g each letter £ 15.00 ,emails £5 etc. telephone calls made £ ? received ? based on your time.
It is crucial that you have records of everything you are claiming ( copies of letters / emails and at the very least a log of the phone calls. Its important you keep your charges realistic.

I have a truecall system & every call in or out including conversations for the past 3 years is recorded,I bought this after losing in court because I could not prove all of the calls.

by 123 Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:24 pm

Thanks very much - provided RD meant resolutions department - after all this ordeal I had sent the letters to the CEO's email and will probably copy them in on subsequent communication. The previous letter already stated that they are considered to be in breach of contract.

Phone log should be available - does it have to be submitted straight away together with the fee schedule or only if it goes to court?

Re: LBA/LBC (letter before claim) - is it sufficient sending it via email or would it have to be via recorded mail?

by **daveiron** Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:20 pm

Hi 123,

RD =recorded mail,sorry should have made it clear.

You will only need call logs etc if you bring a claim via county court.
From experience you will need to be able to provide proof of everything.

If you keep things reasonable ,re the fee schedule ,they may well settle before court action.

by 123 Sat Jul 28, 2018 1:47 am

daveiron wrote:Hi 123,

RD =recorded mail,sorry should have made it clear.

You will only need call logs etc if you bring a claim via county court.
From experience you will need to be able to provide proof of everything.

If you keep things reasonable ,re the fee schedule ,they may well settle before court action.

Thanks for clarifying this - so simply referring to a fee schedule might suffice at this stage rather than tediously going through all the detail and then possibly not getting any of detailed charges claimed at an out of court settlement?

Also - various conditions have been mentioned on the forum for activating a fee schedule e.g.:

https://goodf.forumotion.com/t1131-new-3-letters-for-debt-purchasers -

In this example the fee schedule is activated through a failure by the other party to produce the required documentation
within ten (10) days from the date of this Notice.

So what would be a reasonable condition to activate a fee schedule even retrospectively for emails/calls, generally work that has already been carried out?

by **daveiron** Sat Jul 28, 2018 8:08 am

I would inform them of your fee schedule (they will never agree to it) However let them know that if it becomes necessary to resolve this matter in court .These are the costs you will be adding to your claim as being a fair remuneration for your time spent on this matter.

by **assassin** Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:42 am

I would also add nunc pro tunc after each charge as this means back to the beginning and if it states this then it is much easier to deal with.

Telephone call received nunc pro tunc £3.00 per minute or part minute thereof.
Telephone calls made nunc pro tunc £4.00 per minute or part minute thereof.
(minimum call time of 10 (TEN) minutes applies)

Remove the ambiguity.

by 123 Sun Jul 29, 2018 10:58 pm

daveiron wrote:I would inform them of your fee schedule (they will never agree to it) However let them know that if it becomes necessary to resolve this matter in court .These are the costs you will be adding to your claim as being a fair remuneration for your time spent on this matter.

assassin wrote:I would also add nunc pro tunc after each charge as this means back to the beginning and if it states this then it is much easier to deal with.

Telephone call received nunc pro tunc £3.00 per minute or part minute thereof.
Telephone calls made nunc pro tunc £4.00 per minute or part minute thereof.
(minimum call time of 10 (TEN) minutes applies)

Remove the ambiguity.

@assassin & daveiron: Excellent - Thanks very much for the advice!

Accordingly estimate figures for a fee schedule would be sufficient pre-court with a more detailed break-down for eg particulars of claim, if it went that far?!

@ daveiron - Re: Service of documents - I note you suggested RD and I'm aware that used to be the norm so far, yet when glancing over CPR - Part 6 / Service of Documents:

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part06#6.17 -

It appears email and other electronic transmission is accepted as well?

Previous emails to the service provider's top-level management have received read-receipts.

Alternatively the service provider's customer account also allows for uploading documents directly to their server including time-stamp. -

Hence would a combined email / upload on their server suffice be deemed service of the letter before claim?

by **assassin** Mon Jul 30, 2018 1:38 am

E-mail is not accepted, the only electronic transmission which is accepted is fax, this is because a fax transmission has to have an original document to be fed into a fax machine so there is an original document to campare with a faxed copy.

This is one of the most contentious scams going, they say "service of documents" which is merely to deceive, they do accept some documents but none of those which you rely on which is merely another excuse for a judge to throw out your case.

by 123 Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:23 am

assassin wrote:E-mail is not accepted, the only electronic transmission which is accepted is fax, this is because a fax transmission has to have an original document to be fed into a fax machine so there is an original document to campare with a faxed copy.

This is one of the most contentious scams going, they say "service of documents" which is merely to deceive, they do accept some documents but none of those which you rely on which is merely another excuse for a judge to throw out your case.

Well, that's a revelation!

Also came across something else a while back re service of documents and not sure if applicable (generally, not in this instance) and where this can be found in the CPR?:

"The “Irrebutable Presumption” of Service

It can be difficult for parties to litigation to understand that, in legal terms, service is not the same as delivery or receipt. A claim form is deemed to have been served on a defendant even if it has been returned to the court marked undelivered – provided that it was sent to the last known or usual address of the defendant. The claim form is even deemed to have been served if the claimant knows that the defendant has left that address – unless they know the defendant’s new address.
This rule is so strict that there is nothing the defendant can do to rebut it even if they have conclusive proof that they never received the document. There is even case law that says that service was still good where a document was sent to a property which had previously been destroyed." (source: http://www.aboutsmallclaims.co.uk/serving-court-papers-documents.html)

by handle Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:52 am

However, even if the defendant cannot rebut service he/she can set aside any order made as a result of non receipt.

by **assassin** Mon Jul 30, 2018 6:49 pm

This is because you are looking at the wrong legislation 123, CPR does not govern the rules of postage as this is governed by its own legislation, and here is your first error, you need to understand that a lot of legislation contradicts other legislation and you need to be aware of this and use the correct legislation.

Under postal legislation there is an irrebutable presumption and this is simply that when something is posted it is delivered, therefore at the point of posting it is deemed as delivered and served or serviced, and not at the point of delivery.

Handle has come in nicely with an excellent point and that you have to prove non receipt of a document and once you do you can have a judgement set aside, the courts know that not all mail posted is delivered and have to have a way to cover themselves.

Therefore, once posted it is served, it doesn't matter what the delivery address is, it doesn't matter that a property is destroyed and doesn't exist as they switch to postal law and say it was posted and deem it served under that legislation.

by 123 Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:57 pm

Thanks for pointing this out.

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