A4V

Accepted for Value.

As I am sure Lions share will confirm , What is contained in this video is correct.
It should also be noted that the same advice applies equally to other methods used on this site.
Copying template letters and hoping for the best is not the way to go.

From experience, this is IMO, A4V is (I may be incorrect if I am please correct) for "items" that certainly are public in nature & where you may have been issued with a "payment" or "credit" slip eg utilities, but A4V can also be used where if you like a "bill" has been issued & demanding payment then use A4V (public ONLY), wording IS important. Below is an example, it WILL have to be altered slightly for use here.



as DI states what is contained in that vid you the reader will have to research this & try it for yourself & gain experience by trying things out. What if you get it wrong?  Then if researched properly BEFORE starting then you will know  what to do.

here is an exaple of a "public bill", did it work? I don't know, please contact the author:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jboD8yw-ZJU

I am still learning & certainly do NOT know it all, but after research & some times putting "spin" on things you get to know what works & does not.

No you should not be able to buy a Lamborgini A4V, as this is private!

in the vid DI mentions above, somehting I have thought about but NOT tried,  is adding the words "PAR AVAL" to the narrative written for A4V, why? please research this yourselves.

in the text at the end of the vid, we are all agents of the system as the PERSON cannot answer for anything, so when A4V to ? payment then write PAR AVAL.

I do not know if it works but it is something I have done some research on & through thought come up with "spin", what if this could work?

Am not in a position at the mo to try it as have NOT had a "bill" for some months. If anyone does do it please come back here & lets all know.

YES if I get a "bill" will be sure to let all know.

for those who are researching A4V these vids may help. Although from the US they could be modified to work here.

the 1st from 15 secs in, the wording is important.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvjhO5-93CI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQVcpl7iiKA

possibly CUSIP numbers will need to be researched as well.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T7YdCtoFDeM

certainly use a4v if an issuing bank or issuing finanticial entity appears on the payslip.

after this:

https://goodf.forumotion.com/t3828-a4v

as per my comments above should use only for the PUBLIC side but after some deep thinking - may be too deep, perhaps if utilities are private companies & the pipes & wires "supply" are private then what flows may be public, if that too is a commoditity to be traded then what flows may also be private, this is all IMO I do NOT have ANY definitive proof either way what flows is public or private, it ALL needs claification.

LS

as further study into a4v progresses then from:

https://johnhenryhill.wordpress.com/2015/01/20/accepted-for-value-a4v-best-explanation-of-this-u-c-c-commercial-remedy/

"Acceptance for Value = Taken for Value
Issuing an instrument is not the same as issuing an instrument for value. Accepting an instrument is not the same as accepting an instrument for value. Generally, the issuer of an instrument is the one who has the duty to pay. If an instrument is issued for value, it appears its issuer is not actually a person entitled to enforce it, and may not even be a holder in due course of another enforceable instrument. He has no standing to demand payment or performance, but by issuing an instrument for value, he might be able to open a new account through the transferee’s unqualified taking of the instrument. If the issuer can get the transferee to take the instrument with no conditions on the taking, the transferee is waiving the defects in the instrument he is taking. The main defect is that there is no consideration attached to the offer to contract. There is no value in it at the point it is issued. The issuer is looking for the transferee to provide the value. The issuer is looking for the transferee to provide the consideration for both sides of the transaction. By merely taking (accepting) the instrument, the transferee becomes an accommodation party. He receives no rights, no defenses, and no value for his agreement to lend his name and his credit to the transaction. He does not realize that there is a hidden value in the instrument that he can use to his advantage if he accepts it for value and returns it.

If the issuer succeeds in creating a new account (agreement) with the transferee, he might later be able to close that account through a forced payment or collection through a penal action in an administrative proceeding. The issuer has defenses if he issues the instrument for value, that he would not have if he had just issued the instrument. He has no authority to issue the instrument, so he has to issue it for value. He is giving a subtle notice by issuing it for value that the transferee has no legal duty to pay or to contract. If the issuer were entitled to enforce the instrument, his instrument would refer to a preexisting contract in detail. Since the preexisting contract presumed to support this new simple contract is the application for the birth certificate, or a pledge of allegiance to the United States, or an application for a social security number, or an application for any number of other benefits granted by the United States, the new instrument must be issued for value. If he issues it referring to a nonexistent contract as its basis, he would not have defenses. He would be acting outside his delegation of authority. It appears “for value” may be translated into “to get value” or “to get consideration”. Example: The child acted out for attention, ie. to get attention. The man worked for money, ie. to get money. The issuer issues the instrument for value, ie. to get value."

More over its the last sentance "The issuer issues the instrument for value, ie. to get value." The "billing" Comopany issue an instrument for assumed cash to the value of £?... but at that point it is worthless until it has been accepted, yes it is an offer of a contract, but as stated has no value. In thoery one could decline the offer but as we have seen with gas & leccy, things soon go awry.

So what to do? Accept of course, why? because endorsing a4v, that gives it value & the issuer can now cash, discharge, or whatever they do with it.

IMO A4V should WORK if done correctly. What if done correctly & not accepted? Then under BOE 1882 sect 42 & 43 thats it the debt NEVER existed & any "account" should be set to £0.

I am coming accross more info as I go, but please do not leave it all to me to find, as helpful as I am I in turn also need help.

To all out there, the more research is done & posted by all then the better the chances as a whole we can get that which is rightly ours.

LS